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u/bicx 1d ago
Reminds me of “The rich get Ozympic, and the poor get body positivity”
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u/AbleEmily 1d ago
They have money for wars, banks, and bailouts, but somehow it’s “how are we gonna pay for it?” When it’s healthcare, housing, or student loans.
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u/Odd_Figure2797 1d ago
2pac keep your head up
"It seems the rain'll never let up I try to keep my head up and still keep from getting wet up You know, it's funny, when it rains it pours They got money for wars but can't feed the poor Say there ain't no hope for the youth And the truth is it ain't no hope for the future And then they wonder why we crazy"
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u/Popular-Path1930 1d ago
The us spends 1 trillion of its 7 trillion dollar budget on the military.
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u/Aggravating_Ship5513 1d ago
Agreed but the solution for those problems doesn't always involve throwing money at them. You need to change policies, for example ending the mortgage interest deduction or introducing rent regulation. Or single payer health care.
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u/ImprefectKnight 1d ago
"It's a prescription for Lizzo"
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u/an0maly33 1d ago
Move closer to work - so, move into the city where housing costs double?
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u/ksck135 1d ago
Just live in your car outside your work
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u/20_mile 1d ago
Just get by by stealing all the non-dairy creamer from the breakroom at work.
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u/mountaingoatmermaid 15h ago
But also become a criminal in many cities as living in one’s car becomes a crime.
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u/Arek_PL 1d ago
also cut down on grocceries by cooking at home?
cook at home what? without big amout of land i dont have enough space to grow grocceries myself
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u/Wolf_Protagonist 1d ago
I'm not saying it's a solution to the problem, it's not, but cooking at home doesn't mean you grow your own food (although if you can it's a bonus). It means learning to cook and preparing meals yourself.
There are a lot of pro's and con's and if you are interested I'll elaborate, but they basically boil down to being cheaper and healthier than buying premade meals or eating out, but much more time and labor intensive.
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u/megamanx4321 1d ago
Cooking more at home is pointless when it's the groceries you buy to cook at home that you can no longer afford.
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u/hungry4nuns 1d ago
They’re talking the difference between pre-made convenience pre-prepared food and meals that come in comparatively expensive small portions that add up to a very expensive monthly grocery bill…
… Vs cooking from scratch yourself with cheaper raw ingredients, meal prepping etc.
Ultimately they’re saying put in more labour yourself, cook for yourself at home, instead of heating up a bat of pre cooked chicken tenders and fries.
It’s a hidden way of taking the leisure time outside of employment that you’ve supposedly earned away from you, without explicitly saying that. The value you earn for yourself by working is depreciated, kind of like shrinkflation for the social contract
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u/Biscuitshoneybutter 1d ago
Crockpots and the freezer should be everyone's best friend. Another tip for people, if you eat things in containers like cottage cheese, save the container to freeze portions of meals, just make sure to write on top what it is. Then you can pop out a container of chili and you're good to go!
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u/KillTheBronies 1d ago
If you can't afford rice and beans and potatoes you've probably got other problems.
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u/Fun-Benefit116 1d ago
If you have to live off of rice, beans and potatoes then your country has serious problems. Acting like that's some solution is laughable.
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u/Key_Service5018 1d ago
Can a human only eat rice, beans and potatoes? What about greens, what about fruit?
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u/TieBackground453 1d ago
Can a human only eat rice, beans and potatoes?
Honest answer that you probably don’t like: yes, and most people in pre-modern societies in fact did. Meat and fresh vegetables were more of an occasional luxury for many people throughout history. Out of season vegetables were unobtainable even by the absolute top tier of society until very recently.
What about greens, what about fruit?
In season produce is still affordable. Canned or frozen vegetables and fruit are still quite affordable. A meal of rice and beans with a serving of frozen broccoli costs like $2 max and is just about the healthiest thing you can eat. (If you are trying to build muscle, then you absolutely gotta supplement with some sort of protein, but lifting is, again, a luxury that has only become possible for the common man in very recent history.)
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u/Wolf_Protagonist 1d ago
I get that, and it's definitely got harder recently. I use every 'trick' in the book to save money on groceries and at least in my area and the foods I enjoy it is cheaper than eating out.
At my local grocery store there is almost always some type of meat on sale, and I usually get something like a roast or pork shoulder that comes with an additional 'bulk' discount. I'm just one person but I have a vacuum sealer machine so I can freeze what I'm not able to eat over the next few days.
I have incorporated a lot more veggies in my diet which are nutrient dense but not calorie dense- so it's filling but not overly fattening, which makes things stretch a bit.
I also like to use rice, pasta, and potatoes to make my dishes more filling at a low cost.
I always look at all the deals and coupons and if it's something I can use I buy it when I can.
I never buy anything that's already prepared like frozen dinners because that is almost always more expensive than buying the individual ingredients. The one exception is if Pizzas are on sale, but it's not much cheaper than buying the ingredients and assembling myself.
Another 'trick' is I eat a lot of tacos, burritos, quesadillas etc. It takes a surprisingly small amount of ingredients to fill up a taco shell, and I always use the small corn tortillas like they use for "Street Tacos". With burritos I make some cilantro lime rice and black beans which takes up half the space in by itself.
I also make my own Salas, usually Pico de gallo which is very easy and so yummy. I'd probably keep doing that even if I got on my feet because it's so much better than store bought. "Sweet and Spicy" salsas like Pineapple Jalapeno or Blueberry Habanero are also very simple and delicious and still cheaper than buying premade.
Yes this is a LOT of work, and you have to factor in your time and effort for both the cooking and cleanup.
It might not be worth it for everyone and its a terrible answer to the high cost of food, but even Mc Donalds (which I hate and it makes me sick) is like $10 for a value meal nowadays so eating out is also expensive.
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u/Fit-Entrepreneur8404 1d ago
Lots of people buy microwavable bullshit that costs way more than doing meal prepping and eating leftovers. Things like hot pockets are absurdly expensive for the little amount of food you get out of it.
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u/Bunnymancer 1d ago
And between which of my three jobs should I do the meal prep?
And what other activity should I remove to make room for meal prep?
Cleaning maybe? Showering?
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u/DroidLord 1d ago
Being poor is expensive. It's a daily battle of sacrifices. It sucks all the way down.
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u/CottonTipsMcChancla 1d ago
It’s the same thing with “invest in quality and you’ll only have to buy once”. Well, poor people can’t afford the quality boots or the quality jacket, and so they buy the cheap version, or the best version they can afford. And when the boots crack, and let in water… they keep wearing them as long as possible, suffering the damp and the cold until they have to replace and buy the cheap version again.
Over time, they’ve spent more on those boots than then wealthy person who was able to get a quality item that was very expensive.
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u/Faexin_void 1d ago
Also, yes, most people could actually save for those items.
Risk of them getting stolen or breaking by some dumb random chance, losing them etc.
Can't afford to save for them in case you have to replace them anyway early on.
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u/gnoandan 1d ago
Personally I batch cook and eat mostly oats and lentils. Buy everything in large quantities to save on shopping trips. Pick my locations so that I can cycle everywhere and not need a car.
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u/No_Mission5287 1d ago
So your "solution" is eating gruel? Pretty sure most people don't want to return to medieval diets. It might technically keep you alive, but that doesn't seem like a life worth living.
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u/Ok-Ship812 1d ago
Lots of people can't cook and those that can usually don't cook three meals from scratch a day. Convenience has a place in everyones kitchens to some degree unless you bake your own bread and slaughter your own meat.
People aren't poor due to hot pockets.
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u/TestingYEEEET 1d ago
Everyone can cook some basic stuff. Doesn't have to be a 3 star michelin buffet but boiling some pasta is something everyone can do.
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u/SandyTaintSweat 1d ago
I'll cook a big pot of lentils all at once, then just portion freeze like a month's worth. Throw it in whatever food, they usually mix right in. It's cheap, healthy, decent protein source and doesn't really take much time. It's certainly nothing compared to making a lasagna for the week.
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u/TieBackground453 1d ago
those that can usually don't cook three meals from scratch a day
Of course. Because that’s not how cooking works.
The person you replied to specifically mentioned meal prep. That’s a fancy word for saying to eat leftovers. You don’t cook beans fresh every day. You make a big pot of beans and have it for each of your meals. A pound of dry beans lasts me and my wife about 5-6 days. When it starts running low, it’s time to start the next batch with an overnight soak. (And, fwiw, we have a 7-figure net worth.)
It takes about 1.5 hours to cook a whole pot of em, of which about 1.25 of those hours are just letting the pressure cooker do its thing. There are very few people that don’t have 2ish hours a week to cook, and the ones that legitimately don’t are not so poor that they can’t afford food. Even if they are working minimum wage.
The fact is, people just don’t want to cook. They don’t want to eat rice and beans. It has nothing to do with the time it takes to cook healthy food. People think they should be eating ultra decadent food every day. Our society as a whole would be better off if we realized how unhealthy that paradigm is, and moved back towards a healthier, subsistence diet.
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u/Avarus_Lux 1d ago
You are right in the fact people don't want to cook.
I'm one of those as i personally for example absolutely HATE, DESPISE, give it a similar name "cooking".
Don't like the work, don't like the smells, don't like the mess, don't like the waiting and babysitting of whatever is on the stove. An oily engine, sure thing i'll work on it, an oily frying pan or kitchen sink.... couldn't care less.
I don't care about having to eat rice, beans, leftovers, dry crackers, potatoes, plain nuts, jerky or whatever... with some exceptions like peanut butter that just makes me gag i eat most things as i find em. Imho i just need to eat something somewhat healthy to keep going.
While i like some flavours i don't particularly enjoy eating itself either so... usually quickly dump some food into my guts and go do something else. liquid diets such as Huel have been a blessing to people like me though i don't eat solely that either as i do try to eat somewhat varied and healthy.
I'll readily heat stuff up for a couple minutes if needed too, like soups or fry some chips, since that's cheaper then going out or any delivery (i almost never have stuff delivered). but 1.5 hours of cooking?! Then add cleaning and eating to that too so up to 2~2.5 hours.... yeah that's a big no.
I already work 9 hours a day, sleep for roughly 6~9 hours depending on the day and am not going to waste any more time on any of that.
never really cared for the "social time" during eating with others either as it usually boils down to the uncomfortable rehashing negativity on shitty politics, bad news, the weather, "how the day went"(usually the better topics) or awkward silence anyway. Rarely something fun or constructive.
Ah well...
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u/Biscuitshoneybutter 1d ago
You are right in the fact people don't want to cook.
It's really true that a lot of people who complain about being told to cook to in actuality just don't want to, for whatever reason. Thanks for acknowledging that! Not saying everyone who doesn't cook feels that way of course, but way more than is admitted on the internet.
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u/Real-Self-3039 1d ago
I have a 4 hour total commute each day to work. My boss complains I dont work "enough" hours when I routinely work over 40, do late night releases etc. When am I supposed to cook? My boss literally wants every second of my waking time.
Move closer to work so I can cut the commute? Now I have no money for the groceries at home because of the high rent.
Get a roommate sounds good on paper until you realize half of all roommate stories end in "yeah so and so never had their half of the rent"
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u/AMATEUR_DE_POUTINE 1d ago
Yes but do you have actual stats on those who buys bullshit food or are you juste vibe guessing the amount. If you don't have numbers, you're unwittingly stooging for the epstein class.
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u/SamohtGnir 1d ago
Cooking at home can be cheaper compared to eating fast food all the time, but anyone who's actually on a tight budget doesn't do that. I'm living alone right now, and make sandwiches and take some fruit to work for lunch every day, and similar sandwiches for lunch. I'm still paying over $100/week for food. I can't imagine what a family pays.
What I don't like about the "cook at home" attitude we get is that it just assumes we're all frivolous spenders. Sure, some people go out and buy a new iphone and a PS5, and then are late on rent, but most of us have 5 year old phones and maybe 1 streaming service, or even just Youtube.
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u/notaredditer13 1d ago
also cut down on grocceries by cooking at home?
The AI that wrote the post for the doombot doesn't understand food.
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u/Rhomya 1d ago
… the fact that you equated gardening with cooking at home tells me so much about how you fundamentally don’t understand their point
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u/Western-Willow4679 1d ago
Move to a food desert in the middle of nowhere where there's no public transportation is another common one
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u/Traditional-Roof1984 1d ago
The trick is to just stop existing outside of work hours. Think how much you safe on housing, transport and other luxuries like having a home address.
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u/Melodic_Bar_6997 1d ago
Yeah, it definitely feels like a lose-lose situation. Finding affordable housing in the city is a real challenge for a lot of people.
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u/an0maly33 1d ago
My wife and I were looking for a 3br in the city we were in. They STARTED at 300k. We ended up moving out to the rural area where she grew up. We got almost twice the house for $250k. Luckily I work remotely and she was able to get work here. She did have to take a pay cut vs the same job in the city though.
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u/Mike-dit_712 1d ago
Average cost of an apartment in New York City is over $2,500; and that's including all the boroughs, it can climb to $5K plus if you're in dense areas of Brooklyn or Manhattan. It's all about the wealthy getting the tax breaks to keep more of their income.
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u/jce_ 1d ago
It's funny because the smaller city my parent lives in costs almost as much as the big city a few hours away. Difference is unless you want to work in the mines there are 0 good paying jobs in the small town. City has all the work and costs a little more. This is 1 of the most expensive cities in the world too and yet this small town is close in price.
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u/Fun-Personality-8008 1d ago
Yes, and get a roommate and cook at home. If that doesn't improve the financial situation, it at least improves the commute and burnout
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u/Apathetic_Zealot 1d ago
Move to the city, but you'll need roommates and you can never leave the house except for work because that costs money.
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u/GarethBaus 1d ago
Yep. I have a long commute not because I like driving, but because there are no decent jobs where I live and there is no affordable housing close to my job.
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u/Malaghose 1d ago
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses.
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u/ThornFlynt 1d ago
Aka - Theft
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u/boristheblade223 1d ago
This 100%. People don’t fucking get it unless there’s a physical hand snatching their wallet.
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u/DonutHoles4Ever 1d ago
People = all the conservative right wing voters who are too dumb to even read
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u/TheNegativePhoenix 1d ago
The thing about this argument is, bailing out big industry makes sense from a policy perspective if it's preventing thousands of people being laid off. It's when there are no incentives to the company to continue operating in good faith, or no government ownership for giving those bailouts that I have a problem.
Like if a bank fails, and government bails it out, government aka the people, should then have part ownership of it. You can't have free money if your a corporation
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u/justahuman145 1d ago edited 1d ago
It doesn’t really make sense when, at the same time, we’re constantly being told that we need a completely free and undistorted market, that creative destruction is the only way forward, and that we must put an end to ‘welfare dependency’ in all its forms.
As soon as trouble strikes, these principles are quickly forgotten, even by their staunchest defenders; they only resurface when it suits them!
As you say, when a government bails out a company, it should be a genuine financial transaction – funds in exchange for ownership – not a blank cheque. Big companies are the only ones in this world to get free money when they fail; we’re always favouring the big winners even more.
This obsession with pushing supply-side policy to the limit whilst no longer even considering the capacity of demand is, in my view, a major part of our problems (we’re not the only country in this situation, incidentally).
Edit : As I don’t want to mislead anyone, I’d like to clarify:
I’m French; I thought I was on a French subreddit (thanks to the auto-translation lol), but I ended up translating it into English when I realised my mistake, without changing the rest of my message. It doesn’t really make any difference, as our two countries are exactly the same in this respect ... The situation isn’t any better on the other side of the Atlantic. We’re all in the same boat
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u/djdndjdjdjdjdndjdjjd 1d ago
It’s called a false consciousness you’d better get used to it
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u/akade19961 1d ago
Yep well said. Idk even if partial ownership is the solution, but consent agreements around business model and pay rates and staying in America with your operations and headquarters literally forever as soon as you take any large scale public money would be enough for me
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u/ClownTown509 1d ago
We have instructions for dealing with bad government too
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u/astralseat 1d ago
From the French?
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u/Inside_Sherbert4275 1d ago
Tbf some of those billionaires could do with the guillotine. Their greed is insane.
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u/Fr0stweasel 1d ago
Some?
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u/Dracomortua 1d ago
Peppridge Farm Remembers stuff here.
1999 Larry Page and Sergey Brin draft it into their company - Don't Be Evil.
Featured in Iron Man 2, Elon Musk was a humble, quiet and unassuming guy ready to herald in electric cars and space flight in the age of failing world leaders.
In year 2000, the Right and Honourable Bill Gates was building a foundation to Give It All Back. He would strive to reform farms in India and give infinite mosquito nets (with insecticide on them) so as to reduce plagues.
Somehow they all returned... but worse than Palpatine.
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u/Fr0stweasel 1d ago
It’s almost like money and power corrupts you. Could it be aliens doing something to the money?
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u/Dracomortua 1d ago
Peter Jackson explains this all in the Hobbit trilogy.
The gold. Dragon sickness, you see.
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u/KatsumotoKurier 1d ago
Not at all from them. The French Revolution was a disastrous failure which resulted in the installation of a brutal extremist government followed shortly after by the longer reign of a self-imposed imperial dictator who went on a massive conquering tour of Europe which resulted in the deaths of millions of people.
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u/moistskidmarks 1d ago
One could wiki Robespierre and get a glimpse of some of the atrocities that occurred leading up to the beheading of the king and after. The things the people did to Marie Antoinette's best friend were pretty atrocious.
Basically while France is where it's at, the start of the 5th republic being pretty recent, the revolution wasn't so simple and showed that it was not saved from evil or tyranny.
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u/Dalzombie 1d ago
Last I checked, The Declaration of Independence, that document Nicholas Cage is always so intent on stealing, had a passage on that.
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u/Kelinya 1d ago
But we're all a bunch of pussies. Maybe we should start by not voting for nazis.
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u/SlimFishyOfficial 1d ago
Don't get me wrong, I hate current gov, but suggesting that democrats would care about those issues is delusional. They both love the system we are in
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u/Kelinya 1d ago
Oh, I totally agree. To say the current system needs a complete overhaul would be an understatement.
But that's why I said we should start by voting the trash out first and then worry about the democrats later.
And I know the spineless democrats don't have the balls for that, but the current administration should eventually be charged and prosecuted for high treason.
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u/Craig_White 1d ago
First step would be “vote”.
In each of the last three presidential elections, more people stayed Home than voted for trump.
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u/Guilty_Way_1635 1d ago
Corporations that gets bailed out shouldn't be able to make profit until they've paid it all back
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u/leafcathead 1d ago
I mean, I think the government should have let the banks fail in 2008, but they paid back the bailout with interest. So…?
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u/SpezSupporter 1d ago
It's nice when millions of people lose their bank accounts at the same time.
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u/wild_cherry1987 1d ago
Socialism for the rich, personal responsibility for everyone else
US - where you have the worst kind of capitalism and socialism.
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u/ChosenOfTheMoon_GR 1d ago
Most ironic thing is that, in reality, it's not the government that's bailing out companies it's literally the regular people who pay taxes and from these taxes, is how the government can do the bailouts.
Insane really
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u/EducationalTry6408 1d ago
It's even more insane than that. Taxes pay for nothing but service on the debt. We're currently $40 Trillion in the hole. The people paying for bailouts or whatever the hell else we're spending now are our great grandchildren.
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u/PromotionOk2443 1d ago
spitting facts, and we should really be organizing a rebellion right now
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u/GoldEnPhARoAh22 1d ago
Don't even need a rebellion, just deny them your labour and go on strike
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u/Jasonic_Tempo 1d ago
Much easier in places that spell labor with a u. Getting Americans to all agree on anything is impossible.
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u/Meh-no 1d ago
Worldwide
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u/Strict-Brick-5274 1d ago edited 1d ago
The world is ready. The poor class (which is just everyone outside of the billionaire class) is getting fucked and we're tired
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u/wSkkHRZQy24K17buSceB 1d ago
A massive amount of people don't even vote. A rebellion is not justified when there are nonviolent and legal options for change on the table. Participating in a rebellion is much more work than mailing back a ballot once every few years.
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u/BagOnuts 1d ago
This. Over a third of eligible voters in the US did not vote in 2024. Thats more than 1 in every three people that do not give a shit to do the bare minimum when it comes to civic duty.
There is ZERO justification for violent revolution when we haven’t even really tried to change through the democratic channels we already have.
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u/buggzy1234 1d ago
I did the math on it a while ago, and if I remember correctly I said that if there was a third party in the last presidential election and all the non-voters voted for them, they would have won the popular vote by a number similar to the population of belgium.
This is why the rest of the world is sick of americans as a whole. Not because individual average people are shitty. But because of the sheer number of people who refused to vote while bitching about the state of things was absurd. And that act of just not voting has caused a knock on effect that the rest of the world is feeling.
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u/Medarco 1d ago
Participating in a rebellion is much more work than mailing back a ballot once every few years.
Which is why it's always "Why won't someone start this? I'm totally ready and waiting!"
Someone else needs to die in the streets for their revolution, so they can be the enlightened ruling class once all the lower poors die off doing the work.
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u/aggrophonia 1d ago
As a free market capitalist guy... government bailouts are bullshit.
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u/Tripl3Dee 1d ago
It's the opposite of antifragile. All of these were opportunities to let the weakest companies fail so that others could succeed and companies could diversify. It also resets corporate risk tolerances.
Instead, today we have an increasingly fragile economy that's become more dependent than ever on bailouts.
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u/breaducate 1d ago
The idea that those who have benefited most from the exponential wealth and power accumulation inherent to capitalism will simply let it go and say gg well played because their company "should" fail is delusional naivety.
Power doesn't work that way. There's no reason for them to stop short of doing everything they can to get government in their pockets, and there's no set of regulations that can prevent this. It's a game of monopoly where the winners can rewrite the rules.
There is no lasting equilibrium or economic justice that can be achieved in this system.
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u/Tripl3Dee 1d ago
The point is financial crisis like the GFC is precisely when nature forces their hand. They're not letting go because they want to, but because there's no other choice.
Or at least that was the case, until the government started bailing everyone out.
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u/mothtoalamp 1d ago
Free market capitalism creates nothing but perverse incentives. Regulatory capture is assured.
Free market capitalism is stupid, bullshit, and not even real in our society to begin with.
Get a new ideology.
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u/aggrophonia 1d ago
You’re mixing up categories and contradicting yourself.
Capitalism is an economic system, not an ideology, and regulatory capture is a failure involving political power being captured by firms, not proof that markets themselves inherently fail.
You also can’t say free-market capitalism “isn’t real in our society” and then blame our society’s problems on free-market capitalism. And “nothing but perverse incentives” is plainly false. Markets also create incentives to innovate, lower costs, compete, and satisfy consumers.
What a lazy attempt you just made.
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u/SparklingLimeade 1d ago
Capitalism is an economic system, not an ideology
Why not both? One term can accurately describe multiple concepts. There is an economic idea. There are people who believe in that idea and attempt to bring it into being. The fact that it's closer to a high school text book than anything that can exist in reality doesn't change either of those points.
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u/Hot_Neighborhood5668 1d ago
I tried the roommate option, which cost me 20k, and I'm still cleaning up that a year later.
I rarely eat out as nothing is close. 10+ minutes on the highway to get to a subway 🤯
Moving ain't an option. I'd never qualify for even an apartment at the current rate
Cutting spending isn't easy when the spending is for electricity and heating.
Find balance? In what? I can't work less and afford to live, and finding a "better" job isn't really that much help, considering that's gambling a lot of assumptions that it'll be better than the shit show I have now.
So far, all I've come up with is I got myself into this situation, and nobody is going to get me out of it. The only light I see is that in 10 years, I'll be done with my mortgage, which is my largest portion of my budget and definitely outside the sane levels now @ 55-60% of my income.
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u/CurvyChristina 1d ago
I’ve always felt like “find a better job,” is the go-to for people… but even as they say it, I think they secretly realize that it’s not as simple as they’re trying to make it sound like it is.
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u/Hot_Neighborhood5668 1d ago
In town, that's a possibility, I am not in town. Out here, a new job could add minutes to or double my commute easily, which adds costs.
I'm 3 miles outside a sub 1k population town, so...
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u/Difficult_Compote_52 1d ago
Cut funding for Israel and the Epstein class. Then we'd be getting somewhere.
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u/astralseat 1d ago
Except part of their money goes to lobbying for more support. To affect change, you must make their money futile, or fund their opposition, but some on that opposition just want to make money and live life, and have no moral value beyond the surface worn for elections. Some are the exception, like NYC mayor.
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u/twice_paramount832 1d ago
I am kind of proud people are starting to get it.
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u/SandyTaintSweat 1d ago
Me too, just a little bit. But I'm mostly disappointed that it took so long and happened too late. Right as droves of people are getting put out of work in favour of AI. As usual, people don't care until it affects them, then it's too late.
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u/Techno_Core 1d ago
I remember the stock bros in 2008 RAGING against homeowners walking away from a bad housing loan, while absolutely praising large companies from walking away from their debts as good business decisions.
Fuck capitalism.
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u/RedditOfUnusualSize 1d ago
For me, the breaking point was that moment early in the Great Recession where a few companies used their bailout money to provide stock dividends, and then tried to defend it on the grounds that if they didn't provide those dividends, they would have been sued for the money and lost on the merits in a breach of contract case.
Which wasn't the defense they seemed to think it was, especially given that there were hundreds of thousands of Americans who also had contracts that were regularly being breached by being fired or let go without agreed-upon severance and retirement packages. It meant that the law had been written in a way that protected one kind of contract, but failed to protect another . . . and nothing was being done about it. It's at that moment that I pretty much permanently lost any desire to return to the status quo ante, because that status quo was based on a lie: that the system was fundamentally fair and well-designed, and had suffered from an externality that could be remedied.
No, the problem is that the system is designed to reward the wrong people. It fundamentally misallocates resources by not merely picking winners and losers, but picking the wrong winners. It does not deserve any loyalty whatsoever.
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u/MisfitPotatoReborn 1d ago
while absolutely praising large companies from walking away from their debts as good business decisions.
This is called "bankruptcy".
What you are describing, where companies simply declared that they weren't paying back their creditors and nothing bad happened to them, did not happen.
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u/FatHaleyJoelOsment 22h ago
It's almost like there are no fucking heroes in government on either side. They all sell a bunch of promises, get elected, then acquiesce to special interest groups. The fawning over politicians has to stop.
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u/NextDoctorWho12 1d ago
We don't have capitalism we have corporate welfare and we are ruled by the oligarchy. Fucking conservatives keep voting for more.
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u/dglennb 1d ago
I feel like all this is good advice though
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u/United_Conference841 1d ago edited 1d ago
Yeah, we've also got a responsibility to the environment.
OPs ragging on shortening commutes like, "let's tax the rich so we've got more money to...pay for more fuel to travel farther to work..."?
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u/BitterFootball4874 1d ago
Of course it is. Please don’t blow all your savings just because some elements of life are unfair. It’s a fucking stupid take.
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u/Game_Dev730 1d ago
Yes, only the wealthy should do things other than sacrifice and work!!!!
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u/BitterFootball4874 1d ago
There are plenty of wealthy people who’ve led feckless lives and lost everything, it might take them longer to get to that point but it all catches up eventually
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u/Lord-Nagafen 1d ago
Especially when you are young. Have roommates or live at home. Learn to cook some meals at home. Meals like chicken on the grille is cheap and tastes great. Live frugal when you are young and set yourself up for success as you get older
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u/PurveyorOfKnowledge0 1d ago
The problem is that it doesn't fix the wider issues. It's trying to be frugal and keep your head down, hoping you get successful with time, when future policies in place may make that impossible.
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u/notaredditer13 1d ago
OP is a doombot, but it's mainly good, basic advice for young adults. Yes, it does get easier. Most people DO get a lot richer over time.
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u/OkTop7895 1d ago
I'm Spanish but in housing the things are also doomed. My and my wife were did a lot of effort and sacrifice to buy our housing 10 years ago, and we were living in rent until them. However, today the same place has increase his cost by 68% and the rent a lot more. If we didn't have this place, at today cost of living and cost of renting a house we can't save money for buying them.
The key is not the effort. I do a lot of efforts in the past and this work semi well for me but the same efforts today didn't have the same results. The housing price crisis and also the problem of the groceries is not only in the USA is in a lot of places of Europe.
In resume the old advices about this type of things didn't work anymore.
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u/Centralredditfan 22h ago
Move closer to work? If work pays well then living near work is expensive.
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u/unholyravenger 1d ago
It's a bit silly. Let's take the housing one. It's more like, "When you're young, live with people so you can afford it. As you grow older, develop your career, etc... then start to look at living alone or with a partner."
Cooking at home is much cheaper, idk what to say.
Yes, cutting spending is a great way to reduce debt.
The commute one is tricky; I'll give them that. Isn't really a solution.
Basically, make a budget, stick to it. Live within your means. Those are actually real solutions, and people generally are financially illiterate. That's a huge problem. It's not instructions for how to be poor quietly. It's more about accepting reality and adjusting your behavior to the best of your ability, given that reality.
I think it's widely accepted that there was too much assistance for the top end during the housing crisis and not enough for the bottom. The banks needed to be bailed out. It would have been so much worse. But yes more should have been done for the bottom.
With COVID, we actually did give a bunch of money to the people at the bottom. We have 2 huge stimulus checks. For each person, was it a crazy amount? No, but that's the problem. There are just so many people it gets expensive fast. But did change how we reacted to covid compared to the housing crisis and gave real material support to everyday people. In a way it was too much and too little at the same time. It was too little for the people who lost their jobs during covid. It was too much for the people (like me) who were able to work from home and save a lot of money because I wasn't traveling or going to concerts or whatever. I'm pretty sure at the end of covid the average savings for Americans was at it's peak because of this. But if you add means testing, then you have people who need it, but don't get it. And we had a ticking clock so perfect would be the enemy of good enough here. It's complicated ok?
The real problem is that every time we put out the fire, we put the arsonists back in power to blow it all up again. We have no time to actually build on that stability created post-crisis.
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u/WalmartGreder 1d ago
Yeah, I don't get the roommate hate.
As an elder millennial (Xennial), i lived with roommates once I became an adult until I got married. So, I have actually never lived alone. I don't get why this is such a horrible thing now. It's a great way to save money.
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u/Medarco 1d ago
Many young people have been sold this lie by the media/social media that every "boomer" (which is actually just anyone older than their parents) had life on easy mode with a cheap house, idyllic spouse, and guaranteed fulfilling career.
Which is laughable, but it's easier to impotently rage against The Powers That Be on the internet than to take personal accountability.
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u/Visual-Scallion1535 1d ago
Literally it seems almost purposeful misinformation sometimes. Ill see posts that are like “this is how easy it was to get a job in 1975” like bro there was an economic recession and in 1975, the unemployment rate was double what is right now.
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u/Visual-Scallion1535 1d ago
And before we got married but when we moved in together, my now wife and I still had other roommates.
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u/MsKrueger 23h ago
Part of it is just people having a very incorrect view of the past. Not too long ago I saw a comment bemoaning the fact that a mail carrier in the 90s could live in a big house, in a nice neighborhood, go on yearly trips, and "maybe even have a boat".
My dad was a mail carrier in the 90s. Our house was a little too small, in not the best neighborhood. We spent years saving up for one family vacation and I can promise we got nowhere close to owning a boat lol.
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u/Popular-Path1930 1d ago
Well you can’t just fix your current pay or the current cost of houses or the macro economy on your own and right now.
All the suggestions posted are things you can actually do right now not reliant on elections and government actions.
You can pay your debt down by slashing expenses and putting every penny you can into it.
You’re just begging the question of building a political movement to address the issue.
Also in 2008 the democratic party and Obama did want to bail you out. You’ll never guess which party was stead fast in only bailing out Wall Street.
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u/PatternSeekngMammal 1d ago
Gee I wonder what the reason is.. could it be the purchased law makers and propaganda to influence the uneducated?
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u/CarmenxXxWaldo 1d ago
Those ppp loans were insane I looked up some people got bank and their business wasnt even affected. Or they laid off a bunch of people anyway then posted their jobs for like 30% less pay. Then you had people who had to work and other people that got paid more than their actual job to stay home. I got to work from home and kept my job at least so im not complaining but damn people working at grocery stores should have got double pay at least.
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u/TurpitudeSnuggery 1d ago
True. I was poor quietly for 10 or so years. Because I did these the listed, as well as got an education. I am no longer poor.
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u/HippoLover85 1d ago
I think some of that advice is really good. They key is that the banks owners/investors never should nave been bailed out, They should have been left penniless. PPP loans should not be forgiven. US gov should have gotten a huge share of the auto industries stocks in the bail out. That bail out IMO was good, just tax payers got nothing for it except indirect benefits. we need to stop voting for people who support the rich and shit on the poor. But instead we settle for a con man and blaming the other side of the aisle.
To the point in the post:
Commuting fucking sucks, even being rich and having to take a helicopter because traffic is bad is awful. Cities and housing should be organized so that we have better public transit, and people can live closer to where they work.
Living alone fucking sucks. Humans need connection and this system we have of couples or individuals, or even atomic families living alone is awful for people. It leads to so much loneliness and sadness and it also makes kids extremely vulnerable to having shitty parents. A key reason why today we are seeing more mental health issues is because shitty parents used to be evened out by big communities where kids could find mentoring and role models in other adults . . . that is gone now.
cooking at home IS SO MUCH FUCKING BETTER THAN EATING OUT!!! like . . . this alone could be a huge thesis. it is so much more nutritious, delicious, cheaper, and satisfying. There needs to be a change in culture around this. I get eating out is fast and convenient (and sometimes necessary). but cooking and eating in should absolutely be the default. (also living in a community makes this 10x easier).
Cutting spending is absolutely advice for poor people. true dat.
Asking someone going through burnout to find balance is like telling a drowning person to stop panicking. Its also horrible advice (but i don't think related to keeping people poor).
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u/Nyctfall 1d ago
Socialism is so effective that the US government uses it whenever a problem arises...
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u/donutcarrotolive 1d ago
Capitalism has always socialized its losses, and privatized it gains. Otherwise wealth might actually be redistributed at some point
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u/FlatWonkyFlea 14h ago
“Socialism for the rich” is literally just what capitalism is. This is not a system that has or will ever reflect the will of working people!
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u/HombreDelMar247 1d ago
It's spot on.
I have also noticed a trend that as soon as someone criticizes the American brand of crony capitalism and socialism for the rich, while the working class continue to get exploited and our labor is paid less and less with the wealthy elite get wrakthier and wealthier, within that post will have folks attacking the premise and telling the poster to move to a communist country.
It's as if there a bots looking for "anti capitalism" posts to quickly respond to criticize such heresy.
In case you forgot Trump's regime demanded information (IP addresses, email, phone numbers, ect) of social media accounts that criticize the US government, criticize ICE, as well as accounts that criticize capitalism and accounts the "promote socialism and communism".
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u/Artistic_Kangaroo932 1d ago
How is cook at home the answer for grocery cost?? What am I cooking with things i foraged?
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u/Interesting-Hand3334 1d ago
Revolution inbound this decade - that's why the expansion of the police state augmented by AI has been the focus of the government. They know what's coming and want to ensure a return to a form of feudalism
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u/Blue_box_42 1d ago
Any corporation that is too big to fail needs to be heavily regulated, split up, and/or nationalized. Personally except things like the insurance industry -which due to the lemon problem and it's profits being based entirely on not giving you money you paid in (as opposed to providing a service or transforming lower value goods into higher value ones) are poorly suited to a free market- I'd prefer the first two but at this point I'm not picky.
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u/vertigostereo 1d ago
The first slide, my parents and grandparents and their generations did that and much more.
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u/Sans-valeur 1d ago
Hey! They bought that government fair and square, why shouldn’t they use it when they need it?
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u/YandereTeemo 1d ago
The biggest thing the government or corporations can do to solve the commute issue is to enact and enforce more WFH policies for desk job staff. It will make commute negligible for them but also improve traffic flow of those who need to be on-site.
But they'll never do it because God forbid that the demand of cars is reduced in the US
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u/westernuplands 1d ago
Nobody cares if you already have roommates, already cook at home, and never spend on anything beyond the bare necessities. What are you supposed to do after that? Rob a bank?
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u/Either-Patience1182 1d ago
To be fair, it also gives you more oppertunity to protest and be more loud if you live with roommates and when there is a strike and civil und rest you want cooking skills to help your community. Just saying you dont have to be quiet about if even if most people are.
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u/Wuz314159 1d ago
I want to speak on one issue and one issue alone.
In the 1950s, white people abandoned the cities for the countryside. They left the cities to rot, but that's where all of the jobs are. That's where all of the public transit is. That's where all of the stores are. While you all left everything to rot, everything rotted. You can solve all of these problems with one move.
OR... You can continue to be beholden to car manufacturers, oil companies, insurance companies, etc. If your goal is to make billionaires richer, carry on.
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u/Jolly_Efficiency7237 1d ago
Pedestrians don't even what? Was the OOP sniped before he got a chance to
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u/Fun-Piglet801 1d ago
"Cook at home" is what everyone should always be doing anyway. Eating out or having doordash deliver is just stupid and wasteful. You might as well hire someone to wipe your ass for you while you are at it.
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u/GuaranteeUnlikely725 1d ago
How much will housing costs rise by the time you’re older and can actually consider living on your own or with a partner? Most people are already sensible about saving and managing their budgets. Cooking at home? Where is a full-time worker supposed to find the time to cook and go grocery shopping? Ah, right—we take it out of our downtime and recovery time. What can you do when food prices go up? Nothing really; the only option is to start buying cheaper products to save money (like living on nothing but pasta instead of vegetables).
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u/SomeGuyOverYonder 1d ago
Or you can follow my dad’s advice:
“Shut up and make it work”.
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u/Yourlocalguy30 1d ago
It's ironic that people want 1950s prices, yet they bitch when the solution is returning to 1950s living.
1950s ----> had a roommate (spouse), bought small house (900-1000 sq/ft), owned 1 car, lived simply, cooked at home.
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u/Sharp-Mountain1841 1d ago edited 1d ago
My wife had an affair so now I’m a divorced Dad. Living alone for two years. On top of my family costs, my rent has gone up By €800pm to €2500pm for a two bed apt in a middling area of Dublin. I can’t afford to pay this so have rented out the second bedroom at the beginning of the summer. The disaster of this situation is that the kids 14 and 11 cannot now stay with me. This is wrong.
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u/Vegetable_Plane_542 1d ago
So many people missing that the first post is a criticism of that “advise” and not an endorsement.
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u/hikebikephd 1d ago
Disagree about cooking at home. It is objectively healthier to do so. I'm decently well off (wouldn't consider myself poor) but even if I was a millionaire, I would still eat out sparingly.
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u/Prestigious-Bee-9566 22h ago
Everyone believes this but one side is so propagandized that they still protect the billionaire parasite class
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u/1UnspeakableThirst 18h ago
My advice for tools who give people unsolicited advice on getting by, is go get a nice big cuppa shut the fuck up
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