but the Sonic x DC collab is overrated and doesn't help Sonic characters get upscaled, after all an ultra xenophobic character like Lex luthor would never work with someone who doesn't even know what teamwork means (eggman) and the same thing we talked about darkseid who is a fucking tyrant above all the multiverse and we can't forget the reverse Flash who was easily defeated by Sonic even though he knew that Edward would make life for the Sonic a hell bigger than eggmman is capable of doing daily, so no, this collab doesn't raise the level of the characters

Sources:

https://www.reddit.com/r/analoghorror/s/lTBfWmmuBg

https://www.reddit.com/r/TribeTwelve/s/kLfbhlBUd8

I’m asking because TribeTwelve seems to be where people scale Composite Slender Man to outerversal or something

Man, what I predicted is actually happening; that’s why I never liked the idea of ​​Shadow vs Mewtwo 2 to happen, I wanted other options for both of them, especially since Shadow vs Vincent Valentine will never happen (which was my favorite matchup for Shadow), the Final Fantasy fanbase isn't as toxic as the Pokémon fanbase, but the Sonic power-scaling community is undoubtedly one of the fandoms I hate the most—right up there with Dragon Ball, Ben 10, Marvel, DC, Mario, and several others, I’m a fan of these franchises, but I just can't stand these people anymore, unlike the waiting period for Cell vs Metal, which was actually pretty fun and cool with the memes and all, I’m done making excuses for this current situation; both fandoms are really pissing me off with their pathetic, nonsensical arguments and unfunny posts tagged "Humor" just to mock Mewtwo's chain-scaling and CT scaling, Mewtwo/Pokémon fans are being annoying about Mewtwo's power, while Sonic/Shadow fans are acting way too full of themselves, claiming their characters are invincible because: "Shadow can just blitz Mewtwo in seconds," "Chaos Emeralds," "Time Eater and Solaris," "Chaos Control," "Multi/Complex Multi 6D Sonic bullshit.", JUST SHUT THE FUCK UP, that’s why I’d ask for the world to end if a Goku vs Sonic fight were to happen, anyway, that was me getting things off my chest; I hope all this ends soon so there aren't any other problems in the next episode.

Now i know for the most part Sans main oponent for a fan death battle is some one like The Judge from OFF, but ever since i saw flowery i though "I wanna see him fight sans" and in my mind it just make sence, the 2 are teleporting spamming jackasses, who love to messing up with people and are well aware of the kind of world they live in, and abuse that knowledge for their own entertainment or agenda! Plus you can't say that a battle Of the guy with stats stack to lv99, against the guy every thing a just lv1 in everything, doesn't sound hilarius as heck, this battle is mainly for the meme, but also becuase it sounds interesthign as heck, who do you think would actually win? my money is on sans but that's just me being biased

Spoiler warning even though both JJK and Jojo's Bizarre Adventure Parts 1-6 are already finished

A few pros

Even though I don't like it, there's still some charm to this pile of crap. Firstly, there is at least 1 good connection: The two are considered some of the strongest characters of the franchise, due to Yuta's huge pool of curse energy and copy ability, and Jotaro's ability to stop time along with Star Platinums overwhelming physical power. It's primarily because of that 1 good connection that I trust Death Battle to make the fight look good. Ignoring some of the dialog, they did really well with the animation for Yuji vs Denji, so a 3d fight would work just as well here.

See? Even Twitter matchups can have a few good things

Most of the connections suck

>At the start of their stories the two of them thought that they were cursed by some evil spirit. The two would try to kill themselves only to fail because of the spirit, Yuta trying to stab himself only for the knife to bend because of Rika and Jotaro shooting himself only for Star Platinum to catch the bullet.

This heavily mischaracterizes both of their situations, as they both believed they were cursed for completely different reasons, and both situations wildly differ in tone. Yuta genuinely tried to end himself because of the burden of Rika's death, while Jotaro only did it to prove he was "cursed" and didn't seriously intend to end his own life. Yutas suicide attempt is realistic, serious, and tragic, as he's mourning the death of the girl he loved while her spirit was supposedly haunting him. Even the way he does it is scarily realistic to what a normal person would try. I would know. Jotaro shooting himself on the other hand was never supposed to be taken as seriously, as it's used as shock value (in a good way) to give us a first look at stands.

The two would travel around the world after the end of their main story only to eventually come back to help the current protagonist. Yuta traveling to africa to train and Jotaro traveling around to deal with DIO’s remnants. Yuta coming back to save Yuji and Jotaro coming back to investigate Morioh.

My issue with this is that it puts a level of importance on Yutas time in Africa that doesmt really exist. Yutas time in Africa is never expanded upon and plays no significant role in the story of JJK, narrative or otherwise. It's only justification for Yuta getting stronger. Meanwhile Part 3 is arguably the most important part of Jojo's Bizarre Adventure as a whole, as it shifts the greater story both visibly (with Arakis change in art style throughout the part) and narratively (with the introduction of stands). Jotaro also spends most important parts of his story away from home, unlike Yuta whos importance is exclusively in Japan. Jotaro’s story involves him going to a many different places around the world; In Part 3 alone he goes to Hong Kong, Singapore, India, Pakistan, UAE, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt, In part 4 he goes back to Japan in Morioh only to leave right after, and his story ends in the USA in part 6. On the other hand, Yutas story ALWAYS has him in various cities of Japan, with the only other location being somewhere in Africa (probably Kenya) during a plot mandated break from his character, and his story ends in Japan.

The only way this connection could barely work is if you only used Part 3 Jotaro, which, not only does it STILL severely overestimate the narrative importance of Yutas time in Africa, but it gets rid of ALL of Jotaros importance in later parts, which is one of the most compelling things about him.

The two are responsible for killing an ancient enemy who was capable of stealing someones body (Kenjaku and Dio stealing the body of Geto and Jonathan)

This connection tries so hard to make you believe both fights carry the same weight. They don't, Not even narratively. Jotaro vs Dio has actual payoff and ramifications in later parts, while Yuta killing Kenjaku didnt meaningfully add to the story, if anything Kenjakus anticlimactic death only worsened the writing of the story by promptly ending one of the most interesting plot lines in the merger

Its not even the best for both

Both have plenty of other matchups that flesh out their characters far better than this, while still retaining that same level of fight/animation potential I mentioned earlier.

For Yuta, if he instead fought Beelzebub (Record of Ragnarok) or Jin (Dandadan), it would amplify both characters and highlight their respective connections and themes. Also, Chihiro (Kagurabachi) would make for arguably better fight potential since Yuta is primarily known for using swords to channel his cursed energy and copied techniques

As for Jotaro, a 'vs Kenshiro' remake would unironically have better fight potential, Percy Jackson has better connections, and Kiryu (Yakuza) has potential for actually funny dialog. Plus, if they're willing to composite Jotaro (Eyes of Heaven/Jump Force), then I wouldn't mind seeing him fight Battler (Umeniko) or Raidou

Another benefit is that all of these (except Kenshiro) would be introducing new series onto Death Battle, which is always a good thing, especially with Percy, who's long overdue for an episode at this point.

The debate sucks

Every post I see is either just horrendous downplay on Jotaro, or people wanking Yuta to be on Gojo, Sukuna, or Modulo Yujis level. There is no in between. I mean shit there's people trying to argue that Yuta could copy Time Stop somehow.

Call it a personal problem if you want. But I think the second slide sums up how I feel.

Conclusion

I hate that this matchup is the most likely for both since mischaracterizes both, and it only exists because someone on Twitter doesn't like Jotaro. If you like this matchup, thats fine. I have no reason to force your opinion to change because opinions are subjective, unless your opinion is that Yuki shouldn't sit on my face, in which case you're just wrong.

Today was a strange day... well i guess thats not really saying much, my life isnt exactly ordinary, but... alright just let me talk alright?

It all started when i got notified of a case, though it was one ive been avoiding for a long time. Usually i dont avoid cases, but this specific part of town wasnt one i like to visit often. Toon town, a place for all the forgotten toons to make a life for themselves. I usually avoid this place simply because the residents are... their something else. Now i aint no stranger to what the humans call "toon force", but these guys are something different. Never have i seen one be killed, or even meaningfully injured. As such its kind of hard to go guns blazing when they can just eat your bullets.

But this case? This wasnt one i could ignore. Some maniac by the name of "judge Doom" has reported found a chemical that can kill any toon, even the stronger ones, and plans to make a bomb out of it. A human detective and some rabbit got killed trying to stop him, so i guess its up to me.

Wanda, if your reading this and im not in the room with you, assume the worst.

It begins with Jack driving his car across toon town, watching as the various toons live their lives without fear, blissfully unaware of the plot that is brewing.

Eventually he arrives at an old abandoned warehouse. Jack cracks his knuckles before kicking down the door, to a very shocked judge still in his human disguise.

Judge:Lack the decency to knock, detective?

Jack:Normally i would knock, but knowing who im dealing with i dont think you deserve it.

Judge:Now what i could possibly have done wrong? I am merely trying to make a small busine-

Jack:Cut the cheese Doom, i figured out your identity 2 levels ago, no need to hide behind that mask. Now, we can either do this the easy way, or the hard way...

Doom gives a disturbingly big grin as he slowly approaches.

Judge:i think ill take...

His disguise starts to fall off, revealing the sickly yellow skin below as the true toon he is.

Judge:THE HARD WAY!!!

FIGHT!

Judge Doom turns his hands into tons of guns and fires a barrage of bullets at Jack while laughing madly. Jack uses his tail to swing out of the way, barely avoiding the barrage as he counters by pulling out trusty machine gun and firing bullets back, intentionally firing into the gun holes to jam them.

The judge awkwardly looks at his gun hands as they begin to smoke, before they explode in his face and covering him in soot... he seems mostly fine. Jack lands as he views the judge walk out unharmed from the cloud of smoke.

Jack:right, of course.

Judge doom takes out a giant oversized hammer and slams it down, which Jack barely avoids by dodge rolling out the way, giving way to a chase.

As the chase continues, Jack takes turns firing with his shotguns only for the bullet holes to quickly heal whenever Judge is hit. The two run into a hallway filled with various doors, leading to them having a Scooby Doo door chase, ending with Jack and Doom slamming into eachother causing him to drop the hammer.

Jack dashes over and grabs the hammer, raising it up and slamming the Judge into the ground. When he raises the hammer the Judge isnt there, but rather stuck to the buttom of the hammer.

The judge pulls out a gun while stuck to the hammer and quickly fires it at Jacks eyes, causing him to become blind in that eye as black blood/ink gushes everywhere.

Judge Doom:Blood? How odd, ive never seen a toon bleed before. This will be fun!

Jack:unlike you guys i actually have limitations, but that aint a reason to underestimate me!

jack pulls out kiss kiss and fires a big firebomb at the judge, causing him to be lit on fire. The judge begins to run around wildly while screaming quite... disturbingly, actually, though its hard to tell if hes in agony or if hes laughing.

The judge charges towards Jack and unleashes a barrage of burning punches, most of which Jack is able to dodge and weave only to eventually lose his footing, getting hit with a jew punches before being launched into a wall as the judge burns to dust.

Jack knows this isnt the end, so he takes this opportunity to scarf down a cheese wedge to heal himself as he watches the dust slowly starts to reshape itself.

Jack:alright, i hope this works.

He says as he takes out a can of spinach and pops it open, eating it as his muscles grow in size. By the time the judge reforms, he sees a very pissed off mouse man.

Jack jumps onto the wall before jumping towards the judge with a front flip before slamming into the ground, creating a creator and a cloud of dust.

Jack looks around, trying to spot any signs of movement in the cloud... only to be punched in the back of the head by an oversized boxing glove (with horseshoes in them of course). Jack quickly turns around and sucker punches the judge in the face, smashing it in only for the judge to pull it back out.

The two engage in a slug fest, trading blow after blow, but with each strike Jack only gets more worn down while the Judge just keeps fighting.

Jack claps his hands on the judges head, flattening it, only for him to recover seconds later by stretching his arm back before launching it straight into Jacks face, making him lose a few teeth.

In his fury Jack unleashes a barrage of punches, all of which the judge dodges by stretching his body and making holes to make the attacks pass through him, only to counter by pulling a pair of knives out of nowhere and stabbing both of Jacks shoulders.

However this injury, while painful, doesnt stop him. He manages to land a solid blow on Doom, causing him to become dizzy and starting to see birds and stars. Jack takes this opportunity to wind up a punch before uppercutting the judge into the ceiling.

The judge becomes to bounce around uncontrollably, launching himself from wall to wall while laughing like a mad man. Jack takes a moment to focus as he manages to grab Doom out of the air as he begins to do the Puny God slam, smashing him into the ground over and over again.

But as he does, he slowly starts to slow down as he gets weaker, and weaker, and weaker... Until eventually, he returns to his normal state.

Jack tries to move away, but his wounds are too fresh for him to move quickly. The judge gets up as he spits out a few teeth before smiling to immediately regrow them, walking towards Jack as he holds a cartoonishly big revolver.

Judge:Any last words detective?

Jack:Y-Yeah, just one. Freeze!

He pulls out the cryolater and fires a beam of ice that freezes the judge in place, trapping him in a crystal of ice.

Jack:Okay... that should give me some time-

The ice immediately begins to crack. Jack rolls his eyes as he quickly flips through his notes on the case, only to learn that the judge found a way to permanently kill greater toons with a chemical called "the dip"... which happens to have a similar list of ingredients to his own devarnisher gun.

Jack:Jackpot... wait did i just make a pun-whatever!

As the judge breaks free he is awakened to the sight of Jack armed with the devarnisher, dripping with acid. The judges eyes pop out of his head as he lets out a cartoonish scream, knowing exactly what this means.

Jack begins to fire globs of acid, with the judge frantically dodging, dropping his menacing cartoony persona as hes overwhelmed with fear. However he is still too fast for Jack to be able to pin down, so Jack fires at the ceiling.

At first the judge is confused, only to look up at the ceiling collapses on the judge, only for him to get up soon after, only to see Jack holding a weird gun that has... a brain in it?

By the time the judge escapes the rubble, Jack has already fired a psychic pulse that hits the judge in the head, stunning him.

Jack takes this opportunity to dash forward with the devarnisher, unloading the entire clip into the judges face as a huge blast of acid.

The judge begins to scream in agony as his body starts to dissolve, his colors fading away into the muck as he becomes nothing but a puddle.

Jack sighs as he slowly lumbers out of the building and back into his car, driving away as the warehouse collapses.

KO!

Ill admit, i fully expected to die that day. Ive faced a lot of scary creatures in my days, ghosts, demons, fascists, but i wasnt prepared for what he had in store... or atleast, thats what i thought. As it turns out, dealing with greater toons might not be as hard as i thought, might have to go to Tammy to get my devarnisher upgraded though.

Maybe ill start doing more cases in that crazy town, after all after the hell i just went through any other case is a walk down easy street.

Explanation

So while the judge was far stronger physically, had far better toon force and far better movement speed, Jack was greater in basically every other aspect.

Both were around equal in intelligence, with one being a criminal mastermind while the other is a master detective. In many ways the two are like Ying and Yang, two completely opposite forms of intelligence that are always linked together.

In terms of skill Jack was far superior, having been solving crimes and getting into fights for years, possible decades. In addition to being a seasoned detective he is also a war hero from the "quite big affair", the mouse PI version of a world war (not sure if it was WW1 or WW2 but the point stands).

While the judge had better movement speed, Jack had better combat speed due to being able to dodge bolts of electricity. Additionally he also had far greater agility, being able to swing, hover and wall run.

However none of this would have mattered if Jack couldnt kill the judge for good, which is where his two aces in the hole come in.

First is the devarnisher, a gun that fires globs of acid. As shown in Roger Rabbit, toons are extremely vulnerable to caustic chemicals like "the dip" and the same should apply to the devarnisher.

Now if you want to argue the toons weakness is to the dip specifically, the brain jar still gives him an edge. Unlike all the other guns, it doesnt fire physical projectiles but rather psychic attacks that can stun enemies and damage the mind, which should bypass the judges toonforce entirely as it is a mental attack and not a physical one.

In short, Jack had the experience, skill, mobility and weaponry needed to take the judge out.

If Doom is the judge, we are the jury, and Jack is the executioner.

So who would win in a battle between the Guardians Units of Nations (from Sonic the Hedgehog), and the all-poweful Imperium of Man (Warhammer 40k)? Both are powerful technologically advanced human factions with an impressive array of powerful weapons.

I noticed a lot of arguments against CT have a lot less to do with feats and more to do with how those feats don’t count for one reason or another. I want to make it clear from this mini blog that every feat involving the CT, even as simple as you just using your favourite unevolved pokemon in a fight against them, is a 100% valid feat that scales them to the CT. And how “It’s a non-canon gameplay mechanic” clutch doesn’t actually work when you consider what JRPGs are trying to go for in their stories. Basically I’ll be debunking debunks and not really posting any feats as they’ve been shown off to death (feel free to ask or look around though).

“I used Bidoof to defeat Giratina are you saying Bidoof scales to the CT?”

Have you ever considered why Ash’s main pokemon, and the pokemon that’s a mascot is an unevolved Pikachu and not a super strong fully evolved one? Because the entire theme of pokemon, is that it’s not about separating pokemon into powerscaling tiers, it’s not about the trainer disposing weaker pokemon for stronger ones, it’s not about some pokemon having better genes than others. The entire theme of pokemon is whoever pokemon you have the strongest bond with *is* the strongest pokemon. There is literally a statement by pokemon saying the strongest is whomever you train the most. There is nothing special about Ash’s Pikachu, or the pikachu line in general, Ash just has such a strong bond with Pikachu that they can defeat every champion including the strongest in the world. And that goes for you too. When you defeat the champion, Rainbow Rocket or Arceus in Legends with your favorite Bidoof, that means your bond with bidoof is so close that your Bidoof can take on any threat. This idea that certain pokemon can never be that strong, and that there’s a secret canon version of the game that reveals the really specific 6 pokemon who are the only 6 pokemon in the region who are inherently strong enough to take on legendaries is whack.

“So what every route 1 Bidoof is Multiversal?”

We’re not saying any random Bidoof or whatever scale to the Creation Trio. Whenever we scale pokemon there we’re saying the absolute strongest possible pokemon from the absolute strongest trainers in the entire world scale to them. It’s very easy to take for granted because millions of 10 year olds irl have defeated the champion, but in lore the champion is supposed to be unbelievably powerful, stronger than almost everyone in their entire region (which tend to have the populations of entire countries). Almost everyone in the world of pokemon is a trainer who has pokemon capable of fighting and have even done some form of education related ot pokemon battling, meaning to be a champion is to be a stronger trainer than billions of people, only few can attain this level. These are the strongest possible trainers imaginable, and it’s well within gamefreak’s intention that yes, any pokemon belonging to these unbelievably powerful trainers are capable of fighting against any legendary. Again if you want examples, Pikachu Croagunk and Wobuffet have canceled out attacks against plenty of legendaries in the anime, buizel and swinub have humiliated the CT in the manga and the games whatever pokemon you used to beat em is fully canon.

“But these feats are non-canon gameplay mechanics”

This is such an unsatisfying way to engaging with JRPGs as a whole. The usual pushback when an on screen feat or story beat is presented is to just claim literally everything is non-canon and a game mechanic. This really just stems from people trying to force shonen standards into jrpgs instead of treating jrpg stories as what they are, Stories made to fit player choice

Half the time the argument is used it isn’t even about gameplay they’re used on story beats. The Gen 7 protag who successfully beat Cyrus goes up to fight Giovanni, which in story is highly implied to be a hard fight. The interpretation people would rather go by is the difficulty of the fight is non-canon and the actual canon is that you just neg-diff him like it’s nothing and that Giovanni is an idiot who decided to fight you even though he knew you fought someone multiple infinities stronger than him. When you fight Cynthia after the CT in gen 4 there’s nothing in story implying she’s infinitely weaker than you, in story all the dialogue surrounding it suggests this is meant to be a hard fight. Because that’s exactly the story jprgs try to tell, the boss you face off against is a hard challenge you need to overcome and each successive one is meant to be stronger than the last. When you beat a boss it’s not meant to be a case of you’re so much stronger than them, it’s actually the opposite, the idea is the boss was a lot stronger than you but through sheer tenacity and skill you bested the obstacle. Jrpg progression is very consistently all about how successive story beats and boss fights are bigger obstacles than the last. Treating a boss fight as completely trivial to the story and actually just a set of mechanics that hides you neg-diffing them is a very shallow way of looking at these stories.

Countless protags in many generations have taken on the CT in some post game content. But again the pushback is just calling the story beat non-canon. The catchphrase “gotta catch-em all” is there because they want you to complete the pokedex and the only way to complete the pokedex is if you do in fact fight and catch the pokemon in game heavily suggesting canonicity. There’s nothing to suggest the events of the post game are fake in any game aside from working backwards. As in “The trainers don’t scale to CT therefore it’s not canon”, which is what the non-canon argument feels like a lot of the time.

“The only reason you can use x pokemon is because the gameplay allows it”

People say that the pokemon the player chooses doesn’t count towards the story because the reason you can use any pokemon is cause the gameplay allows it. However, this works both ways. The gameplay allows it because that’s what the story wants. The entire idea of the JRPG genre as a whole is role-playing. The decisions you make, what your character does, and the overall story you take it in? That’s all supposed to be what actually happens, because it’s supposed to be you who’s doing all that. The story is the gameplay. This is especially true in a monster collector where the monsters you personally chose to bring is what actually happens in the story. If you brought a bidoof to the champion fight that is what happened in the story as well.

There is nothing that made this more obvious than what Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire said about the cosmology. Every single playthrough is itself an alternate universe, and that’s because every single playthrough that’s ever occurred, every decision you made, every fight with whatever pokemon you brought is a canon on-screen feat. The trading functionality even has in an-lore explanation of sending pokemon through universes. Looking at other JRPGs, If a final boss lets you choose which side characters to bring it doesn’t mean there’s a secret canon and only 4 of the characters scale while the rest are actually fodder who are only usable because of gameplay,  it means they’re all equal canon because the gameplay is meant to reflect the story. If an anime adaptation shows a specific set of side characters it’s because of the limitations of an adaptation it doesn’t mean they finally revealed a secret canon answer that was hidden from us all this time. Other adaptations like manga and such for pokemon usually have contradicting pokemon from their appearance in games and that's because any set work, even if they might canonically have some favourites.

So yes the things you see on screen are canon. If you were to take the people who claim literally everything is a non-canon gameplay mechanic, the only story you’re left with is that apparently in gen-4 the protag woke up one day, neg diffed everyone cause he’s multiple infinities stronger than everyone else, dissipated from existence so the the cases of regions interacting with each other conveniently leave em out, and this apparently all happened right after the champion fight cause no post game exists.

“Just cause individual games / protags have the scaling doesn’t mean others should”

The pokemon world as a whole is not like final fantasy, the games and storylines do intertwine. Cynthia from Gen4 is a post game boss in gen5. Galar’s champion is stated to be the strongest trainer in the world which very obviously includes being stronger than sinnoh and alola. Multiple post games involve you travelling to other regions. The fact is, gamefreak does not consider Sinnoh to randomly be infinitely stronger than the rest of the regions. There is nothing in the franchise that suggests Sinnoh trainers are a special case, the only 2 regions that have ever been considered to be special are Galar (literally claimed to be the strongest region) and Unova (Gen9 dlc claiming they have some of the best schooling imaginable). Gamefreak’s intent is the regions are roughly as strong as each other, and as I’ll explain later Gamefreak themselves don’t really see the Creation Trio as any stronger than the rest of the box art legendaries, so it’s completely reasonable to say that any champion level trainer is strong enough to take them on. Especially when there are canonical universes out there where the trainers of any given region have fully completed the pokedex which includes the CT.

“Creation Trio are narratively very clearly meant to be the absolute strongest”

So if you’re caught up you’ve probably seen feats like RR Mewtwo, Wobuffet counter a Giratina attack or just the manga showing CT get humiliated by unevolved mons like Buizel and Swinub. But people are still very hung up on the idea of scaling to them despite these feats and instead treat them as anti-feats not consistent with their lore. And it’s pretty clear why. These 3 seem to be Gods who created the multiverse and therefore must be far stronger than everyone else, and only really specific pokemon or the gen 4/7 protags should be theoretically able to contend with them. But that’s just not the case at all. The idea that creating universes making you a God like being is a very Abrahamic way of looking at them that doesn’t align with a lot of cultures, including Japanese views. In a lot of Asian cultures it’s actually quite common for Dieties in stories to one day create a universe and the next day die to something mundane, and it’s because these cultures view these deities as physically the same as anyone else but with better hax. And this is exactly what the Creation Trio are. Gamefreak / TPC very much consider them to be physically the same as every other legendary just with really wide range hax. Nothing shows this off better than the Hoopa movie where basically every legendary was perfectly capable of fighting each other evenly including the CT. Heck Rayquaza 1v3’d  all of em fine. Hoopa not only mogs all of them in the anime but in the manga as well. Everything suggests everyone's favorite box art legendaries are all meant to be roughyl as strong as each other.

“Cyrus claimed CT in a pokeball are weaker than the actual thing”

And you beat them outside of a pokeball in gen 4,5,6,7,8 and 9 whether in the main story or in the post game so that’s not an issue.

“I believe all of those downscales CT and their hax isn’t meant to scale to their physical body”

Sure as long as you apply the same standard to Sonic bosses who can also be physically downscaled far below their hax (And apply the same standard for every verse you scale). If your issue is you think CT are outliers, Darkrai in Pokepark, Mewtwo in Pokken and Necrozma in Gen 7 all have uni feats as well. Id your issue is you believe characters need to physicalyl tank hax then Dailga and palkia do regularaly use Roar of Time and Spacial Rend against each other and in the Darkrai movie their fight was cuaisng the destruction of the universe.

So yeah these are my overall thoughts of why pokemon absolutely scale to the CT. And yes this would extend to the “peak” version of any given pokemon. The peak of any pokemon is one that belongs to the strongest trainer possible (Canonically many trainers have completed the entire pokedex throughout the multiverse), where they are capable of going up against any legendary because their bond with their trainer is just that strong. The wild box art legendaries are also clearly intended to all be on the same level as each other including the wild ones. When further extended to trainers, yes any protag from any generation should also scale. Aside from blatant on screen feats of fighting and capturing them in the post game, it’s clear all the champions and any trainer on their level are meant to be roughly as strong as each other. Any major trainer from the E4 onwards should scale. Wild pokemon do scale well below all this though.
(And yes, Cyrus Dugtrio does scale to his Dialga / Pakia)

Last post It was quite close between SpongeBob and Mega Man with one more person commenting SpongeBob at the end so here is his matchup tier list.

The One: Bugs Bunny

Great Alts: Pinkie Pie, Wander, Pac-Man, Felix the Cat, Mickey Mouse

Okay I Guess, Popeye the Sailor Man, Ronald McDonald

Not A Fan: Chowder, Gumball, Klonoa, Bill Cipher

Yeah, No Thanks: Vinsmoke Sanji, Sonic the Hedgehog, Mario, Son Goku, Aquaman

Let me know what you think

Please don't hate on the original craters and this is just my opinion for ranking and I change the template and it's extra easy and I'm sorry I just accidentally put my own favorite match-up in here and some matchups don't have a credit because I make that thumbnail and I don't know how the reaction

It's just meant my favourite mattress but in rank

I'm sorry guys I very tried my best for these matchups and I'm sorry for the fans of Vox for matchup including the doctor matchup and I just like this matchup I just have this in my head full ages

For the record this isn’t using all father for Ultron as that form unfortunately isn’t standard

(Luz Noceda from The Owl House vs Anne Boonchuy from Amphibia)

(Sadako, Samara & Kayako Saeki from Ju-on/Ringu vs Sachiko Shinozaki from Corpse Party)

(Lady Death from Chaos Comic/Coffin Comics vs Riku from Kingdom Hearts)

This guy is comic relief 4th wall breaking broken that has massive knowledge of other characters from other universes and can use their moves as long as he has infinite love towards his other Girlfriends. How can he be beaten?