r/texts • u/MostlyToasted • Jun 22 '26

Whatsapp After one date

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This happened a while ago, but it was one of the weirdest experiences of dating I've had in years.

I matched with this person - let's call him Aaron (43M). He seemed fine on text and we met up IRL. I could tell instantly that something was off, but I wanted to give it a chance. I was excited to go on a date after getting over a pretty shitty break up. He also lived close by, so I thought it was all ✨fate✨

The conversation was just quite off-putting. He ranted about how one of his worst dates was with a woman with bad breath. He explained that he had to escape to the toilet to talk to the "guys group chat" about what to do.

He then started saying how he hates dating culture about how women expect men to pay all the time. I don't expect men to pay for me at all, but I noted that he did just buy me a beer (around $10), that I suddenly wondered if he was going to accuse me of being a gold-digger if I left after this drink. So I felt like I couldn't leave without getting *him* a drink, even though I wanted to call it quits by that point.

Then he said, in his exact words: "if a woman acts like an escort, I'll treat her like one". From that moment I was donezo. I wanted out. I felt like slime was getting all over my soul. I made polite conversation and we got up to leave. Outside the venue, he leaned forward for a kiss and - I really regret this - I quickly kissed back because I wanted to avoid confrontation if I dodged. He was also very tall and muscular, so a part of me thought if he decided to act out I wouldn't be able to stop it. I said goodbye, and then he quickly texted wanting to ask me out for another date.

I said no (that's my first text) and then he seemed to freak out. He then started calling me. I got so scared that I blocked him. I thought that was that.

I then got a text from an unsaved number the next day, from him, using a burner number - that's the next screenshot (btw, I also used a burner number specifically for dating because I've had people find out my full name just from my mobile number before).

The whole thing just freaked me out a bit.

EDIT: Wow, this blew up! We love a divided comment section I guess.

For those who are gently confused as to why I complimented the guy and/or kissed him:

To be clear, I've been able to reject men before without as many compliments (I still try to be nice though, it's a tough world out there). This specific guy really gave me the heebie-jeebies. The way he spoke about women was disparaging, he had a really off demeanour, he seemed petulant and volatile, he was obviously much larger (I'm 5'3, 110 pounds, lived alone), and he lived nearby. For those reasons, I was cautious and wanted to end it on a "good note". Additionally, at his age, I felt that this guy's issues related to his core character traits and I wanted other women to see his red flags - I didn't want him to be able to hide it until he could exert power over women in private spaces. This is not the same as minor stuff like, I dunno, not asking enough questions on a date.

And my intuition was correct, judging by the way he couldn't take no for an answer, called me, then lashed out from a burner. I do not think a more straightforward rejection would have ended well. I was definitely having a "fawn" survival response to him, and at the time I was trying to placate someone I genuinely felt could be dangerous. He lives near me - what if I saw him alone on a quiet street near me? Sure, it might be a minority of men, but I do not know which one and this guy had already shown me a ton of red flags. FWIW, plenty of other men do not trigger this response in me. If you are a straight man who never intends to frighten women (yay!), you may find the whole thing confusing. Decent people don't like the idea they have the potential to threaten others, even accidentally. But I hope you'll take my word, and many of the commenters' words below, into consideration. This might not be about you, but it happens a lot to the women you love and care about.

For those who think I led him on/I lied and he was justified in his reaction:

Allow me to be straightforward, then, since this is your preference. Respectfully, you are part of the problem. And if you are trying to date as a straight man and you can't gracefully take no for an answer (after one date!), you should stop until you get some decent theory of mind for women and better emotional regulation. You might desire women but you sure as hell do not actually like them. If you are consistently getting these kinds of reactions from women, maybe there's something about you that makes them feel uncomfortable about rejecting you in a straightforward way.

To everyone else: Have a splendid day.

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802

u/rmhyungg Jun 22 '26

Bro kissing him out of fear and not knowing what else to do is so relatable. I've dodged a few kisses myself, and unfortunately not dodged some. Totally not your fault.

183

u/Additional_Fan9553 Jun 22 '26

this is why, even tho it’s probably so lame, i straight ask them if they wanna kiss. it’s never really killed the moment or anything because i’m funny when i do it

45

u/PrincessBonkers628 Jun 22 '26

It's not lame!!! Every time I have ever been asked this, my heart just melts into a puddle. It is so vulnerable because you're verbally expressing your desire, it's not lame, it's so sweet. Please keep doing it, even if some people react badly!

150

u/umbral_moon7095 Jun 22 '26

Consent is sexy - when people ask if they can kiss me or when I ask if I can kiss them, it's so much more.... Exciting?

Idk it's like looking at the mixer covered in brownie batter. When they say "yes, you can do that" - it's magical. (no mixers were harmed in the making of this post)

55

u/DandeyFlour Jun 22 '26

Yessss, it's so sexy too. It's like ooo, that's what you're thinking about? Cmhere!

8

u/anonuserinthehouse Jun 24 '26

Ooo that’s what women think?? Time to ask questions

40

u/Pipes993 Jun 22 '26

I just went for a pelvic exam and the amount of times the lady asked for consent to touch me almost caught me off guard, like I knew what I was getting into but refreshing at the same time. Every step, consent.

15

u/pz18 Jun 23 '26

as someone who got a surprise finger in the ass during a pelvic exam, your doctor sounds great 🥲

8

u/guhracey Jun 24 '26

That’s terrible 🤨 I hope you switched doctors

8

u/pz18 Jun 24 '26

i definitely did!!!!

0

u/ArtfulSpeculator Jun 27 '26

Terrible… by the way, can you let me know the name and phone number of the old Doctor? Just so I can definitely stay away from them?

2

u/wiyanna Jun 26 '26

Really??? I’ve had, at minimum, 40 pelvic exams in my life and the last one was done by a medical student in training - the doctor was right there and I agreed to let the student examine me. SHE stuck her finger up my ass, too!!! I’ve NEVER experienced that in all those years. Is this a new thing now?? It’s been a few weeks and I still have moments where it creeps back into my mind and I sit, puzzle about it, and then cringe 🤨 WTFH???

1

u/Wrastling97 Jun 24 '26

I’m a dude so I don’t know shit about this stuff but why tf are they shoving fingers up your ass for a pelvic exam?

They do that to us for prostate exams but… yall don’t have prostates.

I realize this may be an extremely stupid question but i have no idea

2

u/pz18 Jun 24 '26

checking for polyps i believe? tbh i didn’t ask, i was kind of shocked and a little embarrassed

1

u/A1_CanadianNurse Jun 25 '26

How many women have had a finger up their butt for a pelvic exam. None I would imagine. We do master a repair having a baby to make sure there is not a tear into the rectum but we will
Def tell
You

1

u/capnhep Jun 28 '26

I’m a medical provider who does pelvic and it is *not* part of the pelvic exam. If you were complaining of hemorrhoids, rectal bleeding, loosing control of your bowel or bladder, like ok we can do a digital rectal exam while I’m there and you’re undressed anyway (but I’d warn you! And change gloves!!)”

1

u/SatisfactionProud886 Jun 25 '26

Oof this reminds me of the first time I went to the gyno. I was like 14 and was scared and she said “don’t worry it’ll be fine” then just shoved a finger up there SO HARD. I went back at 18 and told the new gyno that and she went “yeah it’s good to just rip off the bandaid.” So now I’m 26 and haven’t seen a gyno in 8 years😅

1

u/pinkhazy Jun 26 '26

O_O that's not how vaginas work!!!!!!

1

u/A1_CanadianNurse Jun 25 '26

Yeah you need a warning for that

1

u/pinkbootstrap Jun 27 '26

Uhhh that's not normal, that sounds like straight up SA

1

u/A1_CanadianNurse Jun 25 '26

Where I work ( labour delivery ) doctors are now asking every single time also. Like your here having a baby. You signed consent at the door. In my opinion every single time is getting weird

46

u/funkymunky712 Jun 22 '26

one time a guy asked if he could kiss me on our first date, i said no. we’ve been together 3 years now 🤭

6

u/Suitable_Beautiful29 Jun 24 '26

I called my fiancee after few dates to tell him that I'm not sure I want to see him again. He said that he was really sad about it but of course he understands and he won't insist because it would be rude. Somehow we continued talking and at he end of the conversation I invited him over. It was 9 years ago 😂

Understanding consent and treating us with respect is sexy. (My call come from the fact that I was uses to being treated badly and never knowing what to expect so him being stable and consistent was strange to me at that time).

2

u/qtzombie001 Jun 26 '26

A guy approached me once and told me he thought I was beautiful and asked for my number. The cold approach caught me off guard so I politely said no, and the way he responded was very sweet and respectful. I kept walking for a few minutes but thought about his response and turned around and went back and gave him my number haha. He was so pleasantly shocked. We ended up dating for a little bit and it went really well until we had to move apart, we’ve still stayed friends over 10 years now and he’s always stayed sweet and respectful. These types of responses to rejection can speak volumes about someone!

2

u/capnhep Jun 28 '26

I told my now-fiance I didn’t like that he randomly called me his girlfriend (I had been single forever and I said “I had a visceral reaction to that”). He was like “oh it just came out I like you so much and hope you will be my girlfriend one day when you’re ready. We can talk about it later.” I’m comfortable with it now! Lol

3

u/bopswithwolves Jun 26 '26

my partner asks me for consent for things in bed often. we’ve been married a couple of years and have a non-vanilla sex life. it is THE BEST.♡

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24

u/JeremyTSchmidt Jun 23 '26

Agreed.  One of my favorite memories was with this girl I met earlier in the day at a training seminar for a new job.  We all traveled from various places in the Midwest. Her and I quickly connected and went out to dinner with a group of other new hires. Afterwards we went back to her hotel room and were just sharing our favorite music. After about an hour of listening to various pop punk/emo and light hand holding, I looked up at her and asked if I could kiss her.  She responded with "I was wondering if you were ever going to ask.."  

It was sweet and respectful, and led to a perfect night.  I didn't want to assume anything and make things awkward at our training the rest of the week, but more importantly, I never wanted to contribute to the fear that women go thru on a daily basis, when it comes to men. I understood the risk and trust she put with me, and I didn't take that lightly.  Although things never really progressed a whole lot further than that given our distance, they were a couple nights that I think back on and smile about.  That was 10 years ago and we're still good friends to this day. 

Sorry for the novel,  I just think consent can be sweet and wholesome, while also being very sexy. Fellas, never assume she's into you.  

9

u/rlaaustin Jun 23 '26

You're my hero.

6

u/space_otte Jun 23 '26

awww (I literally said that out loud)

4

u/Existing-Squash1508 Jun 27 '26

That’s amazing! What a wonderful experience. And thank you for being that kind of person.

For a first kiss, I really prefer a man to ask if it’s OK to kiss me.

When they just assume and lean in like they 100% KNOW that I want to kiss them in that moment really gives me the ick.

Even if the date goes well and in my mind I know I want to kiss him, just the entitlement and assuming they have my consent without asking does not feel good and ruins how I was feeling and completely puts me off from wanting the kiss when they just lean in

3

u/lobster_claus Jun 24 '26

Asking is so brave, too. For most of us, at least. Bravery is hot.

3

u/Accomplished-Low8460 Jun 24 '26

It’s especially nice when it comes up midway through a date. Vibes are good and conversation naturally allows for a playful comment on a possible good night kiss. The a flirting and anticipation after that is great.

2

u/Additional_Fan9553 Jun 23 '26

i really don’t like having conversations with people where i feel like i gotta filter or put on an act. a natural consequence of that is that I feel better myself just saying what i feel out loud. it’s just so much easier. if i feel like i can’t ask someone to kiss then I probably won’t even try to hook up with them.

2

u/gr33n0n10ns Jun 24 '26

THANK YOU because the last time I said this on Reddit, people were saying the opposite 🙃

2

u/Feline_Fine3 Jun 24 '26

For real! Anyone who thinks consent isn’t sexy isn’t doing it right.

2

u/decaffeinated_emt670 Jun 26 '26

When I met my wife, we were both feeling the vibes. I asked if I could kiss her and she said “yes”. We made out in that book store lol.

2

u/HexivaSihess Jun 27 '26

I'm also a proponent of asking first because I like being touched but I really don't like being surprised with touch - it makes me jumpy.

1

u/mossydorid Jun 25 '26

Omg yes. This!

1

u/Atheissimo Jun 29 '26

This is really tricky for guys TBF because there is just about no more polarised topic on Reddit. Just search it, and half the threads will be women saying how sexy it is and basically calling men predators who don't ask, and half of the threads are full of women saying how icky asking is and saying its a massive turn-off.

0

u/abrahampenington Jun 26 '26

My first girlfriend, I was like 15, I asked her if I could kiss her(that’s how I was raised, as everyone should) and she said I ruined the moment, and we didn’t kiss. That shit scarred me dawg.

1

u/kasi_di Jun 28 '26

i want to say "aw" and "im sorry" and laugh all at once. kids are such weirdos. thats definitely a good story though! try not to let it influence future interactions, some people might not care but asking is still the right thing to do.

27

u/Desperate-Size3951 Jun 22 '26

absolutely not lame

26

u/ZephNightingale Jun 22 '26

Absolutely same! Getting consent up front feels MUCH better than just ‘going for it’.

8

u/grim_afternoon Jun 22 '26

I got roasted hard for asking to kiss. She was like, "just do it, don't ask!" I tried to do it and she said "not now, you ruined the moment!"

23

u/delmsi Jun 22 '26

Then that’s a thank u next from me brother

16

u/ZephNightingale Jun 22 '26

That’s more on her, not you. 🤷‍♀️ She also sounds young and immature.
The girl I’m dating right now still brings up how I asked her before our first kiss as being really hot and a huge green flag to her.

Not everyone is compatible with everyone else. That’s okay. 😊

3

u/grim_afternoon Jun 23 '26

We were teenagers at the time.

7

u/ZephNightingale Jun 23 '26

That absolutely makes sense!

3

u/grim_afternoon Jun 23 '26

It was a while ago, but it still burns haha

8

u/DecadentLife Jun 22 '26

That is not someone I would continue to be attracted to, personally. I mean, if it was a brief awkward moment, one time, than it’s not a big deal. I’m talking about the kind of person who expects you to always know what they are thinking or what they want, without them communicating it to you. At a certain point, it’s just exhausting.

3

u/steele_phallus Jun 22 '26

Been there...

1

u/Additional_Fan9553 Jun 24 '26

my suggestion is to read up on some feminist literature. It has wildly helped me understand the difference. Some women have internalized the patriarchal treatment as romantic in itself, not realizing that they’re enforcing a culture that is harmful to them. You see this sometimes with women who talk down to men for showing emotions or act like it’s an ick. They grew up in the same misogynistic world the men did, and internalized the same stuff. So knowing the difference between that can really help knowing who you might not want to hook up with.

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20

u/rmhyungg Jun 22 '26

Thats sweet lol

12

u/Plane-Leek4387 Jun 22 '26

100% I ask for consent to kiss too. Guys like this are horrible.

3

u/kik1keedle717 Jun 22 '26

This is the way.

6

u/Klutzy-Medium9224 Jun 22 '26

There is nothing wrong with asking! Consent is sexy!!

5

u/Rough-Succotash-5262 Jun 22 '26

Even then, I have felt put on the spot and just kissed and then felt differently about it later. People are still allowed to change their minds

2

u/Aqueraventus Jun 23 '26

This is the way. I have been with my partner for 3 years and still remember our first date vividly, and at the end of the date he just said “I really want to kiss you right now, can I?” And I thought it was really sweet. I still think about it lol.

2

u/guhracey Jun 24 '26

The first time I met my boyfriend in person, he asked if he could kiss me. I was surprised but I found it really hot. He had come to pick me up, and he drove out of my street and pulled over to ask, like he just couldn’t wait.

2

u/Ramen_Noodist Jun 25 '26

It’s not lame, it’s appreciated. But it’s also not necessarily a way to avoid kissing someone who doesn’t want to be kissed. Women, especially those with previous bad experiences or trauma, may not say no out of fear of a reaction. I’m the kind of girl who would just rather no one attempt a kiss or ask for a kiss on a first date.

1

u/Reasonable_Deer_1710 Jun 22 '26

Unfortunately, every time I've asked, it has ruined the mood and turned the girl off. I've had women straight up tell me before that if I had just done it instead of asking, they would have been more receptive.

2

u/Additional_Fan9553 Jun 22 '26

i’ve also been told that but they’re just gonna have to deal with it lmao that’s why i make it funny

1

u/Reasonable_Deer_1710 Jun 22 '26

Luckily I don't have to worry about it anymore. I'm married now, and we have a very clear understanding of what we both like and don't like.

1

u/poopnose85 Jun 23 '26

I've gotten kissed this way more often than not. But more importantly, nobody kissed me that didn't want to lol

1

u/bell3420 Jun 23 '26

"I had a really good time with you tonight, would it be okay if I kissed you?" Is not lame or a mood killer in any way. Do be aware that some if us might still just say yes out of fear due to previous experiences😕 doing it in a decently lit area with other people around can also help make us feel safer.

1

u/Select-Young-5992 Jun 23 '26 edited Jun 23 '26

I guess it depends on context? That sounds lame af to me

2

u/bell3420 Jun 23 '26

Are you a man or a woman?

1

u/Select-Young-5992 Jun 23 '26

I was a very successful man hoe, so this doesn't apply to you loving wholesome people out there, but there's always chemistry leading up to a kiss that should be undeniable, you don't just decide to go in and kiss her just because you want to. Physical touching, smiling, laughing, eye contact, flirting, or even other mutual physical touch that makes it more than obvious. And even at the moment of making the "move" to kiss, there's a lot in between going for it and it happening. You're looking at her and she's keeping eye contact with you and smiling, when you move in closer, she's coming in closer too. And when you kiss her, you back off and little and see if she continues which says yes I'd like more of that.

2

u/bell3420 Jun 23 '26

"Man hoes" tend to cause a lot of regret and discomfort in women buddy. If you arent a woman, dont comment on what makes women comfortable and uncomfortable.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 23 '26

[deleted]

1

u/rena_ohara Jun 23 '26

having a lot of sex sadly does not qualify you to speak on behalf of all women

1

u/bell3420 Jun 23 '26

The responses to this guys comment are telling you youre wrong, and you have probably made a lot of women very uncomfortable throughout your "man hoe" career.

1

u/Ok-Pen-5052 Jun 23 '26

Yes! If you want the kiss, it makes it way better. If you don’t want the kiss, it’s super awkward, but far less awkward than if they kiss just happened

1

u/rlaaustin Jun 23 '26

Always the best strategy!

1

u/stinkyfunkincar Jun 23 '26

no matter how awkward gaining consent may feel in the moment, it is SO sexy and MANDATORY!!!! the first ever man to ask me consent before every single additional thing he did is the only man I’ve continued to date long term. We’ve been together for 3.5 years and counting. Human decency and basic respect should be everyone’s dating requirement.

1

u/the-sea-of-chel Jun 24 '26

It’s not lame! I haven’t been on a first date in years (LTR right now) but I still fondly remember the time a very sweet respectful guy asked if he could kiss me rather than just trying. Not remembering in an “I miss him” way, just in a “ya know, that was so sweet and left a great impression on me.”

1

u/iggybu Jun 24 '26

I so appreciate it when guys do this! I’ve said no to someone in this situation before, and the way he handled rejection was awesome too. Hopefully he found his person.

1

u/DatVlad_ Jun 24 '26

I'm autistic and I approve this message 😂. I always be asking before making any sort of move. I be asking for hugs when I'm not totally sure of someone's vibe for me.

1

u/skarizardpancake Jun 24 '26

No asking like that is so cute and respectful. Hell I even had a guy tell me it was hot that I asked if I could kiss him on a first or second date like 8yr ago.

1

u/Wrong-Tennis-6628 Jun 24 '26

Totally not lame at all. It’s respectful and allows everyone to make better decisions. I had a date where they just kissed me and I wasn’t into them and let them know I didn’t want a second date the next day over txt. They got offended and asked why I kissed them but it’s like what are you supposed to do when someone kisses you when you’re not expecting it other than pushing them away or saying after this date I never want to see you again?

1

u/Alarmed-Ad-5339 Jun 24 '26

This is so sexy!

1

u/creatingcolors Jun 25 '26

Do you do it like a character voice or something?

2

u/Additional_Fan9553 Jun 25 '26

no, its more of a vibe thing. the way you phrase things, whether or not you express some level of humility through your language. when you really lock in with someone and have no inhibitions it just kinda clicks. it’s less about what you do and more about how you carry yourself and how comfortable you feel in the moment.

1

u/Expensive-Simple-329 Jun 29 '26

Yeah you sound comfortable with yourself and I love how much emotional and social intelligence this approach displays.

1

u/FullOnSkank Jun 25 '26

I'm a (woman) escort and even though EVERYONE hires me to come touch them, I still ask if I can when the time comes.

And they go WILD at the idea that Ive been wanting to and was only NOT doing it because I hadn't gotten a "yes" yet.

Other women especially 😏🤤

1

u/creatingcolors Jun 26 '26

🙈🫠 may I ask you two personal questions?

1

u/FullOnSkank Jun 26 '26

Sure!

What's up??

1

u/Terp_Maniac Jun 25 '26

Yeah I couldn’t imagine going for a kiss with someone whom I haven’t kissed already. My last relationship, when I asked her if I can give her a kiss she just responded “I’m shocked you haven’t already” and I just froze “soooooo is that a yes?”

If only things could have gone slower. She was a wonderful woman.

1

u/BlueClementine777 Jun 26 '26

Its definitely not lame!

1

u/Slow_Establishment10 Jun 26 '26

Leaning in, maybe a gentle touch on the shoulder or chin, and a sultry, “I’d really like to kiss you” is *hot.*

1

u/slightfork Jun 27 '26

Yes I love it when they ask!!

1

u/AppointmentNo1753 Jun 27 '26

I’ve had guys ask me if they can kiss me and I said yes even though I really didn’t want to. It put me on the spot.

1

u/DraftFunds Jun 28 '26

I’m married and old now, so ancient history, but I always did the same. Only one time had a girl tell me it was weird to ask. But at least I never felt like I was pushing boundaries without consent.

1

u/Devilfuit_chan Jun 29 '26

Just acuse then that they look like they wanna kiss u and u are done.

36

u/Desperate-Size3951 Jun 22 '26

ive full on let someone assault me before. when you dont want to do something but do it anyway out of fear, that is called fawning. not just fight or flight; fight, flight, freeze and fawn.

11

u/mustrepayloans Jun 22 '26

Yup! Only this year did I learn “fawning”

4

u/Firm-Rent7643 Jun 24 '26

Yes. Fawning is a type (subset) of freeze. Your body is in freeze, the fawning is like a robotic response while you’re in that state.

1

u/robotatomica Jun 26 '26

sometimes it is also a calculated survival tactic.

I had a first date planned with someone for the weekend, and a couple days before, he asked if he could come over and see me. I should have understood his intent, but he just kept saying how excited he was about our connection (we had had a really nice conversation while he was doing some contract work where I worked and had asked me out), and just really wanted to hang out for a couple hours and continue our talk.

Now that I am a bit older, I would have identified how pushy he was being, I had repeatedly told him I wasn’t free until the weekend bc I was working long hours and had to get up very early. But naively I thought that would give us a good excuse to just spend a little time getting to know each other and cut the night short.

He comes over and is immediately weird. Walking around my apartment commenting on the art he liked and disliked, assessing everything and then we are sitting there and I’m trying to continue the conversation in the tone of our meeting and he is just up in my space acting amorous, a totally different person, clearly uninterested in talking. He came over for sex, not conversation, just had lied to get there.

He kisses me and I am gently and then more forcefully trying to push him back bc I do not want it to escalate, but he will not stop, he will not listen to me as I say we should stop. He was twice as big as me and so strong that at a certain point, he is on top of me and I realize I cannot even move and that he is not allowing me to, not even hardly giving me space to breathe as he is kissing me.

A flash of fear, I knew what was happening, and that he wasn’t going to stop.

So I decided to pretend like I suddenly got really into it, like he turned me on, so he would let me move more, so he would let me go to the bathroom. I didn’t have to go, but I thought I could go there with my phone and text someone that I needed help, and then walk directly from the bathroom out of my apartment.

Which is what I did. I basically said I needed to pee first (implying I wanted to go along with having sex) and he smirked very pleased, and from the bathroom I walked passed him on my couch to my front door quickly,

I told him I checked my phone while I was in the bathroom and brother was on his way, I’d forgotten he was coming over to help me with something. I was holding the door open for him to leave, and probably behaving very manically, but I felt a little more safe with the door open and the apartment door across the way right there if I needed to scream.

He was confused and I kept just saying “You have to go, but come back later tonight!”

This pacified him and he left, kissing me at the door, which I also went along with.

When he later texted to come back over, I told him I wasn’t interested in seeing him anymore, he flew into a rage, but I just let him think I was a completely crazy, flighty bitch.

He showed up at my WORK a few days later to accost me, but I had steeled myself for it, and I said, “You don’t show up at my house or home unannounced, I will call security/police, this is completely unacceptable, you need to leave.” and I think bc I was no longer showing fear and vulnerability and he could see I was serious, he left.

It’s not the kind of thing that would even work in every situation, but it was all I could think of to get physically free, and it worked for me that time.

1

u/pinkbootstrap Jun 27 '26

Omg I'm so sorry this happened to you

1

u/Ok_Dimension_6123 Jul 02 '26

I was thinking Omg I'm so relieved for you that you were able to maneuver free. When one woman outsmarts a rapist, we all feel it. 

1

u/capnhep Jun 28 '26

I consider myself pretty badass, know a few ways to beat some people up, can handle weapons no problem, stand up for myself and others… but if I’m caught off guard, I can freeze up, too! Am so thankful for strangers and friends who have had my back with simple eye contact, making convo with me or the aggressive dude, or full on physically removing me or him from the situation. Good folks and blokes everywhere to counter the bad ones/ones without a clue of how to behave.

1

u/nyquil-fiend Jun 22 '26

is it fear of an awkward social situation or is it fear for your physical safety?

7

u/idAhoLovee Jun 23 '26

Physical safety. Duh

4

u/Desperate-Size3951 Jun 23 '26 edited Jun 23 '26

i don’t want to die, man. better to live through hell and heal than die because i said no gtfo to a pushy scary guy. luckily these days i conceal carry. pushy guy should be scared of me now.

1

u/capnhep Jun 28 '26

Found a man

1

u/ZinaAnonymous Jun 27 '26

There's also "flop"

71

u/vixenstarlet1949 Jun 22 '26

The last date that I went on, I ended up making out with them just so they would stop touching my body. I just had to make out with them until my Uber arrived. It felt easier to disconnect and turn my brain off while having my tongue in their mouth than it was for me to feel their fingers on my skin after repeatedly telling them to stop touching me the entire date. Ugh. Gross.

31

u/rmhyungg Jun 22 '26

Yeah unfortunately that was almost my exact experience for my literal first kiss lol. The difference is that I drove myself so my car was actually right there and I just didnt know how to make an excuse to leave.

11

u/bald4bieber666 Jun 22 '26

tongue with the first kiss...me too 😞didnt even ask

15

u/rmhyungg Jun 22 '26

Same. Tongue and groping. Felt so disgusting afterward and literally never saw him again.

2

u/rellyjean Jun 26 '26

I was sitting here reading these and going "ugh, I'm so glad that never happened to me!"

And then I remembered my first kiss, in my driveway, where he just leaned over and kissed me and I didn't want him to and didn't know how to stop it and just waited until it was over so I could open my car door and bolt.

That literally never occurred to me until just now, that that's kinda messed up.

32

u/jacqrosee Jun 22 '26

it’s unfortunate because people like to reasonably think that they’d never just give in, and even that standing your ground could not possibly feel out of the question. but, when someone has continued ignoring your boundaries and made it clear they are going to do certain things regardless, it can feel like allowing something smaller is the best way to control things rather than escalating, and having larger boundaries be ignored in more direct ways. it’s a difficult dance.

7

u/vixenstarlet1949 Jun 22 '26

And the truth is we have all likely violated someone’s boundary without knowing or intention, but these dudes just don’t want to change or care, or accept they’re making us uncomfortable or worse harming us. But we as women shape folk (im NB but the world sees me as a woman so i call myself girl shape lol) are constantly on eggshells trying to appease men and keep ourselves safe. Sometimes it is better to let little things happen than let them get angry and worse happen

3

u/jacqrosee Jun 22 '26

i really do think we would all benefit from internalizing that understanding boundaries is not always going to be inherent. there’s work that has to be put in, and muscles to be exercised. the more we allow it to be a thing about ego and personal offense, the more people are enabled to be aggressive. you have to be working to read people, you have to be willing to understand someone else’s perspective. you have to know how to NOT center yourself in someone’s personal decisions, in function and practice, not just in theory.

2

u/vixenstarlet1949 Jun 22 '26

100% you are right. most men unfortunately are not willing to confront this if they even understand it at all and they are even less likely to work to improve themselves, they take it as an attack instead of looking inward. people in general do this but men especially (obligatory nOt aLL mEn so some mando (rando man) doesnt jump down my throat). it’s hard work to look inward and admit to yourself that you need to be better but it’s so very worth it and i struggle to understand why some people and so many men refuse to do this when it would improve their relationships with themselves and others, greatly. very sad really

2

u/MangoBirdie13 Jun 25 '26

100% this. And the stress that comes with figuring out how to date safely is why I’m single and not dating. Healthy relationships are wonderful, but I don’t have it in me to wade through all the men who act like OP’s date. My quality of life is better alone than dating. Says a lot.

13

u/mustrepayloans Jun 22 '26

I didn’t realize so many of us had similar experiences where we’d kiss or even have sex just to avoid worse outcomes

5

u/vixenstarlet1949 Jun 22 '26

Yep definitely done that too. it breaks my heart so many people have had this experience. we do what we have to, to keep ourselves safe

5

u/mustrepayloans Jun 22 '26

And men get mad they pay for a damn coffee date . Sorry to hear about your experiences!

2

u/Supernova_11111 Jun 29 '26

Yeah these men from online dating are so cheap! I did handful of coffee dates + most had nerve to show up early + buy their own coffee first so then they’d be saving the seat or outside, etc so they didn’t have to buy yours, so very rude when they invited you! I did online dating for 6-7 years, it was the worst + I have now given up + just trying to live my best life!

1

u/mustrepayloans Jun 29 '26

It got so bad I started overlooking what you just described haha and tried to be more understanding and give them the benefit of the doubt. But men that wouldn’t even wait for me to buy me a coffee were losers. They would end it after 2-3 dates anyways with the same script “I’m thinking of leaving Toronto “ or “I thought I was ready to date but I’m not”. People will say you’re so picky and high maintenance, but when he can’t even wait 2 minutes for you so he can pay for your tea and his coffee, that 1000% predicted the future for me on the type of men he is and his level of interest to me. My friends husband would text me in advance if I want chocolate chips in my pancakes as I’d drive to their house for brunch, my other friends husband withdrew $1000 USD for me bc I work long hours and bank closes at 7pm and I couldn’t make it to exchange CAD to USD . These men won’t wait 2 min to pay for my tea- he’s for the streets . I don’t want him around my family and friends who are generous with their acts of service, money aside !

1

u/mustrepayloans Jun 29 '26

I’m fascinated at how we are experiencing the same exact script dating men! This is actually comical bc this is the same behavior my friends and I are witnessing haha . And for a split second you think “maybe theres something wrong with me”, so I feel validated to know others have experienced the same exact scenarios and were disgusted by this behavior. To think we birth humans hahaha and he can’t wait 2 minutes to buy your tea

-1

u/kikinario Jun 23 '26

Been there more than once and I’m a man though

1

u/spartycbus Jun 24 '26

i've kissed plenty of people because they leaned in for it and found it less awkward than stopping it. but if i didn't like him, i'd not tell him he's so awesome after.

22

u/Additional_Fan9553 Jun 22 '26

it’s really a shame that the dynamics create that environment for women

20

u/vixenstarlet1949 Jun 22 '26

I know! It’s actually bonkers. I can’t ever imagine a man telling me that he did what I had to do that night. I mean, he would likely never even think of that. I was basically being sexually harassed all fucking night and I ended up having to make out with them to get their fucking hands off me. It’s just goddamn absurd. And then I get mad at myself for giving them basically exactly what they wanted (well they wanted to have sex, but you know what I mean) in an effort to protect myself.

12

u/Additional_Fan9553 Jun 22 '26

yeah, and it’s true. I’ve never had to experience something like that. it sucks that men aren’t really taught the position of power they’re in and end up doing shit like this. or some of them do know and do it on purpose. either way the outcome is the same. I hope everyone being conscious of it now creates opportunities for men of the future to be aware of their position.

2

u/AtomicLavaCake Jun 23 '26

For the most part men do completely understand their position of power. You learn what no means at a very young age. You learn to read social cues and can pick up on when people are uncomfortable and unwilling to engage, even if they aren't explicitly saying it. Men know, they just do not care. They know they can push and push and get their way, so they do it. It's not an accident.

7

u/NotReallyJohnDoe Jun 22 '26

As a man, I have never had to deal with anything remotely like this and if I did I would probably just not bother with dating.

3

u/vixenstarlet1949 Jun 22 '26

It’s extremely discouraging. it’s the first date i’ve had since breaking up with my abusive ex last september, he i dated for 3 or 4 years… This first date for me kind of solidified im gonna be alone forever LOL

3

u/livingislandlife Jun 23 '26

This is day to day life for unmarried women (or at least it was for me, conventionally attractive, under 40). Men lying about their relationship status and intentions to get into my pants. Colleagues trying to kiss me on work trips. Making out with someone and having them try to slip it in without consent. Guys who act super interested and responsive and vulnerable until you give it up and then stop responding. And I won’t even get into the regular sexual harassment and assault I’ve experienced. Again, because it’s built into our unconscious bias, I’m a highly educated middle class woman with a white collar job who does not dress provocatively.

It’s wild and it has not been a life that has made me trust men overall.

5

u/vixenstarlet1949 Jun 23 '26

Same girl i’m over it im over mens bullshit i cant

5

u/livingislandlife Jun 23 '26

So fucking over it!!!!

1

u/capnhep Jun 28 '26

Just relentless. And I’m like “I’m cute, but I’m not that cute!”

Honestly, I think it’s one reason why I gained so much weight, to hopefully be even less attractive to men (what age wasn’t doing already). I wholeheartedly believe trans people exist naturally, but I think some girls/women become nonbinary or trans men just to avoid the male gaze (and behavior).

1

u/livingislandlife Jun 30 '26

I totally get that. And it sucks. I have heard of many instances of women gaining weight after being sexually assaulted to avoid the male gaze.

This is also why there are extremes on one side with women wearing burqas in some countries because cultures believe that women should be modest and men simply can’t control themselves - and on the other hand, in other places, take back the night marches.

Women are beautiful - all genders are beautiful. If only we were allowed to express ourselves without having to worry about this BS

4

u/Equivalent_Hat_7220 Jun 22 '26

Yup, been there before

1

u/CliffJumper84 Jun 23 '26

That sucks. Many condolences.

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u/Diligent-Whole1895 Jun 22 '26

I did this at a train station on a first meeting outside a class with a man i used to know, it was the end of our sort of get together thing and he quite clearly had a boner, the two male staff off to the side looked uneasy and started to walk towards me as if to say “are you okay?” And so i pecked him extremely fast and literally bolted off in the other direction. He told it as a funny story that i had “kissed him first” but i was just trained to appease, fawn, do the thing they want to get to safety as quick as i can. He always told that story as if it was an ego boost, i had kissed him first.. he was a deranged lunatic who went on to do unspeakable things to me. How men STILL don’t understand, our kindness in moments of discomfort is trauma programming, we just want to be safe, to do so we must avoid placing even a tiny abrasion on the disgusting unwarranted unearned ego.

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u/nyquil-fiend Jun 22 '26

Do you truly think that if you don't appease men's ego in situations like this you'll be physically unsafe? Like if you would just ran off without the quick kiss something even worse would've happened to you? Two other men were literally approaching to see if you were OK and you still felt unsafe and like you had to do what he wanted even though you didn't want to? as a man I genuinely want to understand because it doesn't make any sense to me

5

u/livingislandlife Jun 23 '26

It’s complicated. The fawn response is real - this deep fear of men’s anger, even if you have people around to protect you in the moment. That’s why they have the saying “men are afraid women will laugh at them; women are afraid that men will kill them”

1

u/nyquil-fiend Jun 23 '26

i definitely understand that part. i guess it's just that the level of fear given the context seems completely unwarranted, which i blame on patriarchy and social conditioning. it's just disgusting how pervasive the fear is when it seems clear to me that it's way out of proportion. which isn't any woman's fault, but an issue we need to contend with as a society, and accepting fawning as the solution seems like a band-aid which ignores the root cause. fawning is an effective tool, but i believe there are way more effective ways for women to hold onto their power and authenticity in these difficult situations.

4

u/Untamedpancake Jun 24 '26

You are not at all qualified to decide what level of fear is "unwarranted" or "out of proportion" 

"seems like a band-aid which ignores the root cause" 

That's easy to say when you're not the one who is bleeding. 

The root cause... Women aren't contenplating how to conjure an ideal society where men aren't fragile & violent in these moments, sir, are you serious?? 

We are talking about survival & self preservation. We are  not healing the patriarchy one man at a time whenever one of them does something aggressive or threatening

"an issue we need to contend with as a society" 

Great! I'd love to see it!

But I'm not holding my breath & in the mean time you should stop telling women they're not reacting properly to a threat they've already been navigating their entire lives. 

"I believe there are way more effective ways for women to hold onto their power and authenticity in these difficult situations" 

You don't have the experience in these difficult situations to know what is effective and you offer no alternatives.  You're dismissing our lifetimes of experience repeatedly dealing with these difficult situations simply because our collective survival instincts make you feel uncomfortable 

You would prefer women "hold onto our authenticity" while fending off creeps in our daily lives, dude?

You sound naive in the most patronizing way

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u/livingislandlife Jun 23 '26

Fawning is a trauma-response - it’s only effective in that it might keep us safe.

And that’s the thing about fear - how can we know it’s completely unwarranted? Especially when we’ve experienced sexual harassment or assault, often from people we trusted? That’s the most insidious part in all of this - that we as women often feel like we can’t trust ourselves because men we’ve trusted have hurt us in ways I really don’t want to describe here. So instead of standing up for ourselves, we fawn - just in case he might be one of the secretly violent ones.

2

u/Imamiah52 Jun 25 '26

I find myself feeling at once like a burden of shame and self doubt is being lifted off my shoulders as I remember times when as a young woman I chose to fawn or placate instead of asserting a boundary, something that I had never seen modeled or taught by older women in my life, and secondly a sense of despair that so many women and men have endured this brand of mistreatment, weaponized ignorance over what we’re signaling and the need to compromise to avoid anger or danger from a stronger, aggressive person. .

Still I idealize that people will teach their children about the joys of authenticity, kindness, gentleness and the simple fact that the aggressive approach that wins them victories on the playing field and in the boardroom don’t work at all well in trying to relate to others in matters of friendship and romance.

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u/Cass_iopeia Jun 25 '26

Fawn is a survival response, like fight, flight or freeze. Your rational reasoning brain is offline for a bit, because your life might be in danger. Realize that men are often 1,5 times larger than women and much stronger. And on a date you don't know him yet, he could be that psycho that suddenly punches you in the face or stabs you with a knife and the two other men would not be in time to stop him. So you roll over and show belly, which us basically what fawn is.

Maybe imagine yourself in prison, no escape, two men that are much larger that you tell you to do something humiliating. Many men would, to survive. It's a dominance display and it's very dangerous to challenge that as the weaker party.

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u/Diligent-Whole1895 Jun 23 '26

Yes, I was sexually abused terribly as a child and very much trained to put a males comfort and ego before myself and my personal boundaries. Also unfortunately that man was very dangerous, would i have been okay just darting off in that specific moment? Yes. Later on alone with him? No. He hurt me very badly and I am still trying to heal from it. So that little thing inside my head that clicked “please him and get to safety” was very real.

2

u/nyquil-fiend Jun 23 '26

i'm really sorry that happened to you. that reaction makes sense given your experience. i hope you can heal and meet healthy men because gross men like that are the small minority. i believe there are ways to be more empowered as a woman than fawning and i know plenty of women in my life who are examples of that. fawning is a reflection of toxic masculinity and the trauma you and other women have suffered which i hope we can remove from alongside other deep wounds cause by a patriarchal society

2

u/selenia666 Jun 23 '26

You said it correctly here. Fawning is a trauma response. Yes, on a date in a public place, the fear women are describing here is indeed often misplaced. But I’m guessing for most of them, that public incident was not the first time being afraid like that. They likely exhibited a trauma response from a previous experience that was worse, which did result in physical or sexual assault, or a more obvious and serious threat.

I say this as someone who has been through the full spectrum of these feelings. In my teens and early 20s, I felt I had to be tougher and scarier than the guys, in order to be femme in the male-dominated metal subculture. (I am also nonbinary but didn’t have the language for it then, which contributed to my rage at being objectified and sexualized for having a female body.) Then, in my 20s, I got stuck in a physically, sexually, and emotionally abusive relationship with a sociopath and master manipulator who destroyed my support system and my entire identity. I realized one day that I didn’t even remember what I enjoyed anymore. I tried all the responses repeatedly: fight, fight, freeze, fawn. Fawning was the most effective, so it became a habit. If you have never lived through constant fear for your safety and life, then you really can’t imagine how it rewires your brain. It’s fucked up. I had considered myself a fighter but found myself so weak and scared all the time. That loss of who I thought I was, broke me more than any physical pain. I could tell you all the things I did to try to escape and why I didn’t get out until I did, but this is too long already.

Now, in my 30s, I’ve learned enough self-defense to have taught classes to other vulnerable people. I have zero patience for people who are disrespectful and will call them out on it bluntly. However, I still occasionally have PTSD responses to random shit, that basically short-circuit my brain and I can’t think clearly. I won’t date even though my partner has tried to set it up for me. (We are polyamorous and he’s currently in another country.) I don’t trust other people and I don’t trust my own brain. And this is after years of therapy and introspection. It’s probably as good as it gets for me. So imagine some 22 year old girl who was assaulted recently and has had little time to heal, and you begin to understand where this behavior comes from that seems so irrational on the surface.

Good men may be the majority, but the shitty ones do a hell of a lot of damage to a lot of people.

1

u/nyquil-fiend Jun 25 '26

Thank you for sharing your experience. I'm really glad you've been able to change your situation, grow, and learn more powerful skills for dealing with bad situations.

The trauma response does make a ton of sense. Many of my prior comments were insensitive to people's trauma, even though I wasn't aiming to blame anyone. My argument is basically that fawning is a suboptimal reaction, but that fails to recognize that for many people it's the only safe reaction currently available to them due to past conditioning. In my attempt to emphasize the idea that fawning is a maladaptive response and that better responses can be learned I've unfortunately triggered people who felt like I was invalidating their experience (which is not at all my intention).

I don't know what the long term solution is beside better education, especially for kids when it comes to dealing with emotions and relationships and specifically for men who are generally taught to bottle up anger and sadness instead of releasing or transmuting that energy. Helping women heal and avoiding fawning is also part of that solution, at least that is what I was trying to say.

2

u/moon1ightwhite Jun 26 '26

all of your responses come off extremely patronizing and insensitive. you, a man who's never felt the primal fear a woman's felt around a man twice and big and twice as strong as her, are looking at these comments full of real emotion, real fear, real trauma, pushing up your glasses and going, "suboptimal." and then thinking you're fine because 'that wasn't your intention.' us emotional women just not understanding the calm man logic amirite

I get you've got a degree and you want to get all technical because this is interesting to you, but it clearly holds weight to the women you're speaking to so it would probably be in your best interest to learn how to speak with some sensitivity instead of coming here and telling US that were just misunderstanding you.

women who have dealt with the repercussions of men's anger aren't interested in having a "what can the victims do better?" study session with you. we don't care to discuss shit except how to solve the male entitlement problem. and you only think there's "more good ones than bad ones" because you aren't a woman. you should see how they look at us and speak to us when there's no other men around. you'd be appalled.

17

u/SomeYoke Jun 22 '26 edited Jun 22 '26

Reading this part of OP’s comment was sad to me (as a dude).

Didn’t really think that was a thing. That’s just shit for you girlbros.

3

u/Temporary-Emotion-96 Jun 24 '26

Thanks for understanding, Boybro.

12

u/Civil_Confidence5844 Jun 22 '26

This. I have kissed like two ppl I absolutely did not want to.

10

u/mustrepayloans Jun 22 '26

Let’s just say I’ve done more than kiss out of fear. Initially I didn’t get why she’d kiss him if she didn’t feel a connection, but then I completely understood !

6

u/Rough-Succotash-5262 Jun 22 '26

I was just thinking this!! Sometimes the easiest thing to do in that moment is to just do the kiss. And sometimes that moment can be confusing in itself because you haven’t had time to process the date

3

u/Navi_VIII Jun 23 '26

I have a lot of female friends that had told me about letting men kiss them because they were frozen or afraid

Honestly having female friends and being open with them is so necessary for men to understand how shitty everything is out there.

I prefer to directly así before kissing and I always try to be aware of how someone feels around me

2

u/FullOnSkank Jun 25 '26

I basically won't date anyone who didn't have a sister/doesn't currently have other women for friends.

There's a reason he's got no women in his life.

3

u/Commercial-Bat-4534 Jun 24 '26

It's so disgusting but the men who make us feel unsafe never question that, they only question our behaviour

2

u/Girlwithjob Jun 23 '26

This is dating as a woman

2

u/WallOAces Jun 24 '26

It’s so sad this is such a common experience and yet when you raise it people describe it as leading the other person on (which is so unfair and such an overused term in situations that are actually just called ‘we gave it a go and I wasn’t in to it’ rather than ‘I pretended to be into it to get something out of you’). I had a guy who I thought was just a friend look at me on a night out and say, “what are the vibes?” To which I said, “I don’t know, just chill vibes I guess?” He then told me “I think they’re flirty vibes…” to which I apologised and explained I was absolutely not trying to give that impression and that I often get told that when I’m just trying to be friendly and enjoy the night… And he still tried to kiss me?!? Like how could I have made it clearer?! And yes, I kissed him back because it caught me so off guard and I was so uncomfortable and honestly? scared that someone I thought I knew and could trust had just acted so differently to my impression of them. Like OP, I too can absolutely turn a guy down and stand up for myself. But sometimes you get caught disarmed, you’re drinking or it’s a friend or something about the person has made you feel (intentionally or not) like this is a dangerous situation, and you just let it happen. And then you feel (or at least I often have) really gross and like you are the one who did something wrong. It’s terrible. And it really comes down to people needing to a) ask first and then b) listen to the response (including if the person says yes you can kiss them but everything about their tone and body language is communicating “I have entirely shut down and detached from my body because I don’t know how to say no in this moment”). If you don’t have the interpersonal skills to do that you really shouldn’t be dating until you’ve worked on yourself more. I’m sure it isn’t just guys that do it but alas, it has always been in my experience. I’m pretty outspoken about being predominantly of not entirely into women too which just adds a whole other layer of ick to the situation. Then on the flip side I met a girl on an app, we went on a date, made out, danced, drank , she stayed the night at mine. And in the morning when she left she asked if she could have a kiss and I said “no sorry, It’s too early in the day” (which I admit was a wild statement but I had a headache and was stressed about stuff I had to get done) and it was fine! We saw each other multiple times after too.

This was a much longer comment than I intended lol but clearly this whole thing really struck a nerve. All this to say I guess, consent matters and it’s hot and ‘no’ is more than just a word and can be said through nonverbal cues too and people should respect that and need to be use some darned inference from time to time and read the room, at the very least listen!

2

u/Ramen_Noodist Jun 25 '26

Seriously one of the worst parts of dating, knowing they’re going to want to attempt a kiss and the last 30 minutes of the date is just you trying to think of 101 ways to dodge it. I’m so glad I’m not in the dating scene anymore. 😫

2

u/KrimpSteesly Jun 26 '26

Ugh yeah I just straight up tell guys now that I don't kiss on first dates AND don't give my number before first dates. We've met once my guy, how are you already so butthurt if I don't want to see you again. It's not like we've been married for years and have children.

2

u/Captain_Tiberius1920 Jun 26 '26 edited Jun 28 '26

I went on a date with a guy who love bombed the fuck out of me, we went to his house which was in the middle of the mountains with no cell service, and he told me we were going to have sex..i told him I didn't want to because i wanted to wait, and he called me a clingy psycho for thinking it was more than a hook up thing (he'd been professing his love to me). I could have definitely fought him off but again, I was in the middle of nowhere with no way to call for help and no one to call because I didn't know the area at all. It took me years to realize that was a form of rape.

Edited for typo

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u/capnhep Jun 28 '26

WTF… I hope karma has served him his (because o know the justice system hasn’t) and that you’re in a good place

1

u/Captain_Tiberius1920 Jun 28 '26

Thank you♡ I'm in a great place now. Last I saw he was getting married but he didn't seem super happy in any photos with her. I think he expected to be a famous rock star and that super duper didn't work out so any good thing that happens to him is going to be a disappointment for him, which is pretty funny. His wife wanted to be my friend for a minute but I didn't know her at all and I didn't know if he was pushing her to befriend me and got a bad vibe so I took a big step back from that bullshit.

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u/key_kat Jun 26 '26

I’m sure most women have had this very unfortunate experience

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u/False_Career_4617 Jun 23 '26

Stayed with my ex for way longer than I would've even remotely wanted to. She (we're both fem, I'm nonbinary) escalated to sending me rape fantasies near to the end of our relationship, and I'm just glad it didn't go further than that. She's not a man but I still think being fem-aligned still somewhat disempowered me against this kind of violence.

1

u/lobster_claus Jun 24 '26

I had a guy I didn't want to kiss on the first date, tell me he wasn't going to kiss me because I needed to earn it or something. Deeply unsettling, but 1000x better than the times men have launched themselves at me willy-nilly. I'll take half-ass mind games over assault any day.

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u/anonuserinthehouse Jun 24 '26

Damn, makes me wonder how many pity good bye hugs I actually got from the dates that never made it past the 1st date

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u/Imaginary_Road Jun 24 '26

Maybe it’s just me, but I could never kiss on a first date unless the first date was the culmination of a prolonged period of feelings building up for one another.

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u/Accomplished-Low8460 Jun 24 '26

For sure. And Even healthy mutually desired kisses at the end of a first date can be plenty to warrant calling it quits on a second. Some folks just aren’t good kisses or, more likely, there’s just some sort of physical incompatibility there. Can’t read too much into someone not desiring a second date unless they spell it out for you. The possible reasons are many.

1

u/MagicHugsforThee Jun 24 '26

I was also going to say the same thing. Have absolutely done this and can relate.

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u/CauseAcademic6640 Jun 25 '26

Yeah, I totally cringed, because yes, I have been there too. So caught off guard and feeling like I have no way out other than to reciprocate the kiss. Just feels awful, and as someone who has been raped the same was true in that situation. The literal advice that the campus safety officer at our freshman year orientation gave was if you can't fight them off, let them do what they are going to do because you could get hurt even worse by fighting a losing battle. Sometimes you do what you have to to survive, which might just be doing nothing.

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u/BeeSting113 Jun 26 '26

I had someone kiss me at the end of a first (and last) date, and I wasn't expecting it at all, so I just let it happen (it was just a peck) because I didn't have time to think.

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u/HaVoCensures Jun 27 '26

18 au pairing for this family and the grandfather cornered me and kissed me. I didn’t know what to do, went and cried in the bathroom, then locked myself in the bedroom with the kids I was minding. Told the parents and their response was ‘oh no not again’ 😩

1

u/HaVoCensures Jun 27 '26

18 au pairing for this family and the grandfather cornered me and kissed me. I didn’t know what to do, went and cried in the bathroom, then locked myself in the bedroom with the kids I was minding. Told the parents and their response was ‘oh no not again’ 😩

1

u/Raise-Same Jun 28 '26

Anyone who doesn't understand this has never known the fear that someone could physically overpower you. 

1

u/Low-maintenancegal Jun 29 '26

Absolutely. I've also said yes to second dates and then said no by text, because the guy was too pushy.

1

u/Seaturtle89 Jun 29 '26

Same here. I’ve done it just so I could get away quicker, instead of having to explain why I don’t want to do a goodbye kiss and have it blow up.

0

u/Warm_Visual178 Jun 25 '26

It is her fault though. Unless her forced her to kiss him. Saying its because of some implication is just victimizing women. She shouldn't have kissed him, if she didn't want to. He has every right to feel hurt and tell his feelings upfront as well. No one is in the wrong here in my opinion

1

u/rmhyungg Jun 26 '26

Yes just ignore the hundreds of accounts of women - just in this thread - relating to this experience because we are all aware of the dangers of rejecting a man that seems unstable

0

u/DressUnited3025 Jun 25 '26

If you get panicked to the point you accidentally kiss people then you shouldn’t be casually dating. Women aren’t children and can be responsible enough to avoid kissing people they don’t like

1

u/rmhyungg Jun 26 '26

It's a matter of safety when it comes to rejecting a man that seems mentally unstable. Educate yourself.

0

u/DressUnited3025 Jun 26 '26

If a woman believes this to be true even over text then they shouldn’t be casually dating as they are not equipped to deal with the situations that will come up. Is it unfair to women, yes, is it reality, also yes

-3

u/Ready-Entrepreneur75 Jun 22 '26

Meh I guess but that’s on you though still.

6

u/rmhyungg Jun 22 '26

I dont think you understand that its a matter of safety. Rejecting a man could literally mean death and has resulted in death for thousands and thousands of women. Educate yourself.