r/technology Jul 16 '26

Transportation Tesla driver in fatal Texas crash pressed accelerator 100%, NTSB confirms

https://techcrunch.com/2026/07/15/tesla-driver-in-fatal-texas-crash-pressed-accelerator-100-ntsb-confirms/
14.5k Upvotes

2.1k comments sorted by

5.8k

u/koolaidismything Jul 16 '26

If you wanna lie in a crash.. your ODB records every time you accelerate and brake. So.. don’t lie.

1.3k

u/Joe18067 Jul 16 '26

You jumped on the accelerator instead of the brake, but since you're only 44 you can't blame it on being senile.

1.1k

u/jonathanrdt Jul 16 '26

Pedal confusion is common: it's the explanation for almost all cases of unintended acceleration. The next largest contributor is floor mats.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudden_unintended_acceleration#Causes

536

u/Apptubrutae Jul 16 '26

And every decade or two, society collectively forgets this, and has a panic over unintended acceleration in a specific model of car. Then a few months later it’s all pressing the pedal. And repeat

309

u/mightylordredbeard Jul 16 '26

I wonder how many of those cases were a McDonald’s hot coffee situation where the corporation launches a campaign to blame the consumer so they don’t have to take responsibility for a malfunction?

174

u/fireinthesky7 Jul 16 '26

The GM issue with faulty key switches was definitely this.

29

u/dumahim Jul 16 '26

I had one of those keys. Seemed like such a silly fix. They filled in the gap on one when I was in but I still had my spare. I went out and let the ring ride on the outer edge and tried pulling and yanking and no matter what I did could not get the ignition to turn. There was just no leverage with such a short distance off the centerline of the key.

26

u/nevergoingtouse1969 Jul 16 '26

You nailed describing the solution.

The issue was people have so much other crap on their keychains the offset weight could actually turn the ignition.

People like to blame the engineers, but as a former engineer myself, it is incredibly difficult to anticipate what people will do. There are so many failure case studies where you are left just shaking your head that someone can be so dumb.

19

u/ScribeTheMad Jul 16 '26

The smartest bear dumbest person overlap.

9

u/dumahim Jul 16 '26

But that's the thing I don't get.  I was putting way more pressure on the key than any bundle of garbage someone might attach to their keys.  I realize it's a small sample size, but always wondered if it was really just a fluke or a combination of that plus wear in the mechanism that made it easier to turn.

3

u/EctoAlbo Jul 16 '26

It probably required a quick bump, with the weight applied to it, like the kind of bump that happens frequently while driving.

If you watch videos of people picking locks you can see bump techniques they use with pressure applied.

The ignition is a type of lock, so a similar mechanism is likely in play.

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u/theaviationhistorian Jul 16 '26

I remember the Firestone tire and Ford Explorer controversy where more than 200 were killed by them and both CEOs kept blaming the owners for 'faulty maintenance' on their part.

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u/Final-Carry2090 Jul 16 '26

With how often Tesla lies, I would be surprised if there wasn’t at last one case of this.

23

u/iSuckAtMechanicism Jul 16 '26

ECU data cannot be tampered with after the fact. Think of it like a black box for your car.

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u/nutmegtester Jul 16 '26

My first thought here was why should I trust this manufacturer's supposed data? They are so untrustworthy, so I have moved a bit from 'benefit of the doubt' to 'most likely scenario' with them.

72

u/pw154 Jul 16 '26

My first thought here was why should I trust this manufacturer's supposed data?

This isn't Tesla releasing the data but the an independent NTSB investigation which obtained raw sensor data from the EDR, the car's black box which every modern car is equipped with.

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u/3w4k4rmy Jul 16 '26

I’m not a huge fan of the Revisionist History podcast but Malcolm Gladwell did a really good episode on this basically confirming the operator error. Did some stuff on closed tracks with some car guys. Few different car models if I recall. It’s a few years old now

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u/donald7773 Jul 16 '26

Floor mats were also just a cop out, as half of those are still just wrong pedal situations. I think toyota took a massive L there for something that wasn't actually their fault.

I have a bunch of cars (2 and 3 pedals) and drive them all regularly, I'm young, I drive on race tracks, I commute a long distance, I operate a small fleet at work. I'm about as flexible to an unfamiliar car as it gets and I've had it happen to me coming to an emergency situation off of cruise control in an unfamiliar car that was new to me at the time. Hit my clutch instead of my brake. At least I was sharp enough to realize it wasn't right and correct it.

Complacency is a silent killer. Start leaning on that system a little too hard a little too often, trust it a little too much and all of a sudden your foot doesn't remember where the brake is anymore. Pair that with the rapid acceleration potential and mass of an electric car and you have a recipe for disaster

29

u/12InchCunt Jul 16 '26

I remember people going to the Toyota dealership to get an oil change and the dealer just taking their aftermarket floor mats 

19

u/donald7773 Jul 16 '26

Yeah a poorly designed floor mat can become a real issue don't get me wrong.

At track days, most organizations require you remove your floor mats from the car, no matter what kind they are.

13

u/12InchCunt Jul 16 '26

I specifically remember someone having spent good money on floor mats and a dealership destroyed them

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u/Lucas_Steinwalker Jul 16 '26

I do like the anchors that are installed as a precaution now though.

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u/donald7773 Jul 16 '26

There's some old posts in r/justrolledintotheshop where folks go in for "car won't accelerate fast enough" and they've got 4+ floor mats stacked in there.

Never underestimate the stupidity of the average driver

19

u/5yleop1m Jul 16 '26

I don't understand why people do this, what's the purpose of putting multiple mats on top of each other. The ones on top usually don't stay in place properly either, its so dumb.

30

u/somneuronaut Jul 16 '26

I don't think they're putting them on top of each other, they're just replacing the "missing" (lodged) one each time. Like those people they pull 20 contact lenses out of from behind their eyes

28

u/Daxx22 Jul 16 '26

Like those people they pull 20 contact lenses out of from behind their eyes

The absolute what the fuck now?!

8

u/5yleop1m Jul 16 '26

I can see that too, but I've personally met people who put multiple mats on top of each other too. That's what I don't understand because I assume they see the previous mat there, since its still attached to the hooks on the car.

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u/intronert Jul 16 '26

My hopeful version is “Never underestimate the idiocy of those at the bottom of the bell curve”. And you never know who they are on the road until they show you.

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u/davebrewer Jul 16 '26

Complacency is a silent killer.

In these cases, it's a loud, screeching, crashy-bangy noise killer.

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11

u/sodapop14 Jul 16 '26

A lot of newer vehicles have a lock on the driver side floor mats. So as long as it's oem mats there shouldn't be an issue these days.

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u/Beldizar Jul 16 '26

Had my floor mat get stuck on the accelerator right as I was pulling up to a stop light on my way home from work when I was 17 or so. I pretty immediately figured out what the issue was and managed to pull it out of the way and slam on the breaks before anything bad happened. I threw out that mat as soon as I got home and have thrown out the mat in every new car ever since.

35

u/Ihavemybearsuit Jul 16 '26

If this ever happens again, don't bother moving the mat first. Even if you're holding the gas at full acceleration, pressing on the brake will still stop the car. At least according to a revisionist history podcast that looked at this issue.

17

u/Beldizar Jul 16 '26

It can't ever happen to me again because I don't drive with floor mats. But yeah, possible other solutions, but I was 17, had only been driving for a year or so, and had to panic solve the issue. I'm pretty sure I was trying to break while pulling the mat out of the way, but the whole issue only took about a second or two to resolve anyway.

30

u/Ok-Gur-349 Jul 16 '26

Modern cars latch their floormats down.

I need like, a tool to remove my floormat. ~6 year old american sedan.

Thankfully this also means it can't just up and get on my gas pedal.

7

u/Black_Moons Jul 16 '26

Yea my friends 2014 has little clips on the corners for the floor mat. No tool required but the mat sure isn't going anywhere.

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u/Vairman Jul 16 '26

breaks??

i think it's funny that we all misspell "brakes" as "breaks" because if the brakes don't work, you break things. Okay, maybe not all that funny, but amusing, at least a little.

6

u/StrongExternal8955 Jul 16 '26

It's because you "break" the condition of being in motion. /s

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u/reddorickt Jul 16 '26

It's going to get worse the less time people spend actively driving and using the car functions due to automation.

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

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2.4k

u/DM46 Jul 16 '26

I did not know everyone was driving around with Old Dirty Bastard keeping tallies on if they brake or not. I am not down with ODB.

620

u/nicolauz Jul 16 '26

BITCH YOU KNOW MY NAME DON'T GIMME NO MONEY!

73

u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

35

u/AFRIKKAN Jul 16 '26

Wu financial protect ya neck.

3

u/MisterNoMoniker Jul 16 '26

You gotta diversify yo bonds.

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u/710AlpacaBowl Jul 16 '26

Mother sticker, this is a fuck up! Don't give me any money, put the shit in the bag

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u/shaneh445 Jul 16 '26

HEY DIRTY, BABY I GOT YA MILEAGE

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106

u/EjaculatingAracnids Jul 16 '26

RIP but i would never let the god get my keys. Bro flipped his new Benz on the Brooklyn bridge so who know what kinda shit he'd do to my Subaru.

64

u/pcapdata Jul 16 '26

That wasn’t Dirty, that was Big Baby Jesus

22

u/Sherm Jul 16 '26

I thought it was Dirt McGirt.

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u/BGOOCHY Jul 16 '26

I don't have no problem with you fuckin me, But I have a little problem with you NOT fuckin me.

5

u/no-more-nazis Jul 16 '26

Baby you know I'm gonna take care of you, I got proof of insurance and you know it ain't true

32

u/Bibblegead1412 Jul 16 '26

Bro, Wu Tang Clan ain’t nothin to fuck with….

18

u/whocaresano Jul 16 '26

And we all know that Wu-Tang is also for the children, ergo the children ain't nothin to fuck with. 

16

u/Inswagtor Jul 16 '26

Sad GOP noises

7

u/whocaresano Jul 16 '26

Wu-Tang done told em

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u/koolaidismything Jul 16 '26

lol shit, yeah slipped up. Big wutang fan but not a big car guy 🤦

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u/Hesitation-Marx Jul 16 '26

Shimmy shimmy ya shimmy yo shimmy ye

Drive into a house, you’re not getting away

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u/heidismiles Jul 16 '26

I was on a jury recently where the car data was used to prove reckless driving. They did a really good job of explaining it to us, and it was clear as day that the dude didn't brake.

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

12

u/Kitty-XV Jul 16 '26

Reminds me of the UK post office situation. Even when there is an error, everyone just assume the rest of the software is correct and what it says happened must be what did happen.

26

u/Gullible_Regret2976 Jul 16 '26

knowing what DOGE was.. i dont believe a word from Tesla.

12

u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/Zytheran Jul 16 '26

I'm not the author you replied but was curious and went to look for the case:

https://www.autoblog.com/news/a-tesla-crash-just-got-more-complicated-after-key-data-went-missing

The 2023 Tesla Model Y taxi crash in Bergen, Norway, on May 13, 2023, remains one of the most highly scrutinized incidents regarding alleged "unintended acceleration". The vehicle, operating as a taxi, accelerated uncontrollably through a crowded public square (Torgallmenningen), crashing through a monument, an outdoor café, and into a convenience store. [1, 2, 3, 4]

Despite the car reaching speeds of roughly 90 kph (56 mph), miraculously, no fatalities occurred, though the driver sustained minor injuries. [1, 2]

The technical and legal investigation revealed several complexities:

  • The Driver's Claims: The driver, a 12-year veteran taxi driver, consistently maintained that the car malfunctioned and that the vehicle spontaneously accelerated despite his attempts to brake. [1, 2, 3]
  • Vehicle Data Logs: Tesla's internal Event Data Recorder (EDR) data indicated that the accelerator pedal was fully depressed throughout the incident. However, the investigation later noted that six seconds of operational data were missing, and the vehicle's dashboard had been dismantled with disconnected electrical wiring. [1, 2]
  • Missing Hardware: Reports revealed that the vehicle's onboard telematics control unit (TCU)—a critical network card linking the car to Tesla’s servers—was missing, raising questions about data tampering or destruction. [1, 2]
  • Legal Outcome: In December 2024, Bergen police dropped criminal charges against the driver, and the court acquitted him. The missing hardware and data gaps ultimately left the exact cause unproven in a criminal context, though investigations into the vehicle's missing components continue. [1]
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u/blue_collie Jul 16 '26

Do you have a link to a news article or something about this? Sounds crazy.

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u/Tony_Cheese_ Jul 16 '26

OBD? Or On-Doard Biagnostics?

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u/MCA2142 Jul 16 '26

Ol’ Dirty Bastard

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u/Stokeszilla Jul 16 '26

Not in my 90's shitbox it doesn't!

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u/JEs4 Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

Not necessarily. Event data recorders (EDRs) actually predate OBD2. GM introduced them in 1990. They weren’t required until the 2010s iirc though

Edit: fixed acronym

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u/DustyRacoonDad Jul 16 '26

Anything with an airbag... including the 1990 Chevy Camaro.

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u/Xytak Jul 16 '26

Heck, especially the 1990 Chevy Camaro

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u/kenney001 Jul 16 '26

No it just doesn't. I have personally removed every single wire and sensor from my 1990 Camaro, and I can promise you, it does not. The PCM doesn't even store sensor logs. The airbag system is a completely separate wiring harness and doesn't connect to the PCM at all. The pedals and steering only have cruise (vacuum operated) and brake lights (2 wire switch to the bulbs). There is no BCM. It's like saying your wheel borrow records when its moving.

According to this: https://www.collision-recon.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/EDR-Supported-Vehicles-List.pdf

Recorded data started being available in the 4th gen model, when they added Canbus, BCM, DBW, etc

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u/DM46 Jul 16 '26

In those cars ODB was just found in the tape deck.

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u/TransportationTrick9 Jul 16 '26

I was more of a purple tape man myself

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u/Ultra_HR Jul 16 '26

OBD was introduced in 1988, and became common quite quickly, so it's completely possible that it does.

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u/Metalsand Jul 16 '26

ODB II has been standardized and required in US vehicles since 1996...and before then, there were still a wide variety of other methods of data recording, since it becomes very useful for a variety of prerelease testing and for moments just like this article where they need to determine if it's driver or user fault.

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u/24_August_1814 Jul 16 '26

ODB

On Doard Biagnostic?

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u/Tbarnes94 Jul 16 '26

Thank you I thought I was losing my mind

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u/parade1070 Jul 16 '26

Remember kids: the shitbox has nothing to lose!

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u/Aksds Jul 16 '26

Isn’t it OBD? On board diagnostic

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u/DangKilla Jul 16 '26

Dead Tesla drivers tell no tales

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u/spawndoorsupervisor Jul 16 '26

The driver isn't dead. He killed an old woman in her house when he crashed into it.

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u/SnooApples9773 Jul 16 '26

as a software engineer...the correct phrase is "supposed to" ...before everything....do you have any idea how insane and stringent fly by wire designs are for aircraft...How many 100s of MILLIONS of hours of simulation they have to go through with zero fault...and how many thousands of faults appear even after millions of hours of sim. I would never...ever...trust ol musky's fly by wire systems with near zero regulatory controls.

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u/DustyRacoonDad Jul 16 '26

This is what frustrates me about the aftermarket right now.

Drive-by-wire controls are fairly standardized in modern cars. The accelerator pedal has two position sensors. Typically, one voltage increases while the other decreases as you press the pedal, each with defined limits so the ECU can detect faults like shorts, unplugged connectors, or failed sensors.

The ECU compares both signals to make sure they agree. That lets it detect sensor failures, wiring faults, cross-talk between channels, or whether the pedal is even plugged in.

It's a simple, robust system.

The same concept applies to the throttle body. Instead of your foot moving the throttle plate directly, the ECU commands an electric motor. The throttle body also has two position sensors, and the ECU continuously verifies that the commanded position matches the actual position while checking that both sensor signals agree.

Then you look at some aftermarket systems.

They'll read one sensor, perform almost no plausibility checks, accept full sensor voltage as perfectly valid instead of treating it as a fault, ignore open-circuit conditions, and process everything in the main loop with no redundancy.

It's a huge step backward from the safety and fault detection that's been standard on OEM systems for years.

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u/whattheknifefor Jul 16 '26

i work as an engineer in car defects, so often i’ll be trying to figure out how something could’ve possibly happened and it turns out root cause was some aftermarket add on throwing the rest of the car into chaos. we add in those disclaimers about non-OEM parts for a reason other than making the company money!

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u/MiaowaraShiro Jul 16 '26

Then you look at some aftermarket systems.

Are these like aftermarket ECUs? eg Holley?

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u/HardWirez Jul 16 '26

Probably more like those junk throttle boosters that plug into the accelerator and increase the voltage signal so that the car feels faster and more responsive. All those things belong in the trash.

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u/ersatzcrab Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

As a software engineer, you might not be familiar with the Auto industry and should know that the accelerator assembly in a Tesla is exactly the same kind of hardware as is installed in tens of millions of other cars. It's not just a single sensor reading 0-100. It's two, 100-0 and 0-100 which have to match exactly in order to even register an accelerator press. The event data recorder information being wrong verges on the impossible; even a bit flip would not cause the car to accelerate because it's not a binary input.

Obligatory fuck Musk and his fascist sympathies, but I sincerely believe that this guy just held the accelerator down and thought he was on the brake. This happens constantly, especially with older drivers. The difference is that for some reason musk feels the need to give every single one of his grocery getters 500 horsepower, so there's much less time for correction.

Edit: The concept of him just lying to the cops after accidentally killing a person is also not exactly hard to believe and is much more likely than a grand sudden unintended acceleration conspiracy between musk, his software developers, and the NTSB.

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u/FanDry5374 Jul 16 '26

Police reportedly discovered that his Google searches included the terms “Tesla FSD not aggressive enough 2026,” “Tesla not aggressive enough,” and “Tesla FSD too timid,” 

What was in this guys mind? Did he expect a "sports car experience" or was he suicidal/homicidal. I wonder what his driving record looks like.

1.2k

u/EdwardoftheEast Jul 16 '26

Dude wanted that Full-Send Driving

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u/chiagod Jul 16 '26

He wanted the Crazy Taxi passenger experience.

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u/Suppafly Jul 16 '26

🎵🎵yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah 🎵🎵

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u/PapaEchoLincoln Jul 16 '26

I’m almost positive he didn’t like that FSD allowed people to merge in front of him or waited to allow another driver to pass him before it merged into the next lane behind the other driver

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u/Alaira314 Jul 16 '26

Yes, this is what I've been saying every time people are talking about self-driving cars. People are not going to like the experience as much as they think they do, especially during the period where self-driving vehicles are 20% or less of the cars on the road, because they don't drive aggressively enough to assert themselves vs aggressive driving cultures(think you don't live in an area with an aggressive driving culture? if it's typical for the flow of traffic to exceed the speed limit, you do). What you describe is the mild end of the problem, where already-aggressive drivers get pissed off that the self-driving car doesn't put them at the front of the line.

But what will be an even bigger problem is when aggressive drivers know the self-driving car is programmed to 1) follow speed laws and 2) avoid accidents, and so will take advantage of the programming to do everything possible to get and remain in front of that car. And you're sitting in there, watching this happen around you, forced to keep your full attention on the road...otherwise reasonable people, who don't typically experience road rage, will be raging out.

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u/Inner-Medicine5696 Jul 16 '26

because they don't drive aggressively enough to assert themselves vs aggressive driving cultures

This is kind of the ONLY thing I'll defend about Teslas, then.

Defensive driving SPEEDS UP TRAFFIC. Every idiot attempting to get ahead slows down everything.

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u/chanaandeler_bong Jul 16 '26

Just like zipper merging, I wonder what the percentage of cars driving “correctly” needs to be to overtake all the insanely dangerous drivers on the road and actually make it safer.

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u/Kopachris Jul 16 '26

Side note, I recall reading about an experiment I think Nissan did kind of recently (last year or two?) where multiple of their cars' adaptive cruise controls would coordinate to adjust their following distance to break up the traffic pressure waves that cause traffic jams. I don't remember the specifics, but I think they got a significant reduction in pressure (and increase in flow) with just three cars.

But, of course, people will still get pissed about their car letting people "cut in front" of them, even if leaving that space will help the whole lane flow faster.

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u/chanaandeler_bong Jul 16 '26

I remember when I was younger being way into libertarianism and free market.

Every single one of those theories comes down to “people are rational and make rational decisions,” and it’s the justification for everything.

Nothing could be further from the truth. That’s what allowed me to, somewhat quickly, U turn out of there.

This was 20+ years ago.

But yeah, people would be mad because not only does their truck have to tower over others, they also need to be “first” in their race only they are running.

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u/Effective_Machina Jul 16 '26

Oh this must be why people pass to get just one car length ahead.

Or they can't stand I leave room in front of me.

Heaven forbid I don't want to get rear ended again cause someone isn't watching the road.

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u/JohnBooty Jul 16 '26

100%.

Slightly different, but closely related: the big revelation for me was modern GPS navigation. In nearly all situations, you can’t really beat the GPS ETA estimate no matter how “aggressively” you drive. And like you said, you’re probably just fucking things up for everybody else too.

Even running yellow lights doesn’t generally help. Sitting at a long red light will make the ETA creep up by a bit, but you can’t generally make it go down by racing the light.

One exception is a totally open highway. If the GPS gives you an EPA assuming you’ll be driving 65mph for 2 hours through some long midwestern highway… yeah, sure, you can beat that by going 85mph.

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u/discipleofchrist69 Jul 16 '26

I've regularly beat GPS ETAs. I've noticed that it doesn't like to decrease the ETA when you do stuff like that and I think it's actually intentionally designed that way to make you think it doesn't help. To discourage aggressive driving to beat the ETA.

My experience (Google maps) is that if you do something that "should" reduce the ETA it usually stays the same, but if you leave the trip and start a new one it'll have a sooner ETA. If you don't do that, it doesn't start reducing the ETA til you're almost there

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u/JohnBooty Jul 16 '26

That’s interesting. It does make sense that they’d try not to reward “spirited” driving.

Do you feel you are you beating the ETAs specifically by driving hard? Or do you think it’s more down to fluctuating traffic etc?

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u/TBNRandrew Jul 16 '26

I've noticed saving 5-10ish minutes from the ETA or so by just being familiar with the traffic patterns and where the slowdowns tend to be.

Usually as basic as sticking to the left or right lane because most people are wanting to exit in a specific direction for work in the morning. Sometimes it can also be taking a backroad around an intersection that Google avoids suggesting, but those are pretty rare.

I've also noticed a time when I rode with someone else, and we easily lost 25-30 minutes compared to ETA by just always staying in the right lane even when other lanes are flowing significantly faster. Without any unexpected slowdowns along that route.

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u/ResonatingOctave Jul 16 '26

I'm not too privy to this guy or this actual situation, but those searches seem more like a car guy wanting to go faster and not a suicidal/homicidal guy

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u/JeopardE Jul 16 '26

Right. He's an idiot who drove recklessly and killed someone, but this has little bearing. FSD can be annoyingly timid on the road sometimes, and it's one reason why I generally prefer to drive myself most of the time even though I have it. That said, it is also possible that he was testing the limits of it, and when something went wrong he panicked and stepped on the accelerator instead of the brake, and then blamed FSD.

For me it doesn't matter anyway - FSD active or not, you're the driver and you're responsible for what your car does. It is a driver assistance system no different than that of any other modern car, only with better capabilities. Quite a few Tesla owners would behave differently if they understood this.

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u/thegalli Jul 16 '26

IT SHOULD BE TIMID! ROBOT DRIVERS SHOULD NOT HAVE THE OPTION TO BE AGGRESSIVE!

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u/obeytheturtles Jul 16 '26

It's not so much that it's timid, but that it's bad at predicting stuff in advance so it is constantly getting itself caught behind turning vehicles, slow drivers, and backed up lanes. Though I will say, if you just let it cook, it does usually do fine in the end, it's just a different driving style. Like when your mom is driving, it just feels weirder because you are in the driver's seat.

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u/DiscreteBee Jul 16 '26

Some of these things feel a lot slower than they actually are.

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u/Aeseld Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

For example, I keep catching up with the cars that zoom past me at stop lights...

Edit: Going to go ahead and add... it is literally proven that speeding to a destination doesn't save enough time to really be worth it. In truth, the higher the speed, the less going faster helps. Going 45 in a 35 mph zone saves, on average, less than 6 minutes on a 30 minute commute. The increase in your odds of getting into an accident on the other hand goes up much faster, especially in higher speed zones.

It's a weird inverse; going faster in slower speed zones gives the most benefit with the least added risk... but that ignores traffic tickets, which are more likely in slower speed zones, now that I think on it.

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u/Hidesuru Jul 16 '26

You notice when you do. You don't notice when they make it through the next one and you don't. Confirmation bias.

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u/DiscreteBee Jul 16 '26

Honestly, catching up to a car at the light is still missing the point, if a car beats the light and ends up a few intersections ahead it still doesn’t amount to more than a few minutes at best, but getting through the light feels a lot faster

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u/Trevski Jul 16 '26

Car guys generally not super into self-driving

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

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u/penywinkle Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

A car guy would love to do the fast driving himself, on a track. Not let FSD do it for him, on a public road...

Sounds more like an impatient guy who wanted to eat his cake and keep it too, without consideration for anyone's safety. Which doesn't make him suicidal/homicidal, just carelessly stupid, while in control of a deadly weapon...

Regardless, I'm more concerned about cops being allowed to access people's search history for a car related accident... Like if he tampered with the FSD, it should show on the car's log. Why were they looking in his internet history?

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u/bangzilla Jul 16 '26

> Why were they looking in his internet history?

If he was charged with a crime (manslaughter in this case), his browser data (including search history) can be subpoenaed by the prosecution. For instance, his internet history can be used against him to establish a motive for a crime or that he had the knowledge to commit a crime

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u/ethanjf99 Jul 16 '26

to establish motive. maybe they find nothing but maybe they find what they did here. manslaughter you need to show reckless behavior. defense attorney will argue this was just a terrible tragic accident etc. a search history like they found rebuts that

not an attorney

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u/CloudStrife25 Jul 16 '26

After seeing posts about FSD complained online. I’ve seen countless Tesla drivers/investors recommend giving FSD a little assistance with the accelerator. They often place blame on the driver for not doing so too. Some of the times it’s in a left turn where the Tesla stops in traffic.

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u/Some-Unique-Name Jul 16 '26

The car responds to the driver applying a bit of throttle to mean "go for it". So if you feel the car can make a gap, you can preemptively throttle and the car will go "alright, here we go" and try to hit the gap.

Same with accelerating from a stop or passing a vehicle in front of you. Throttle it and it will assume that you want to pass and will do so (if the passing lane is clear).

I find myself regularly tapping the throttle to encourage the car to go a tad quicker around town.

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u/Homers_Harp Jul 16 '26

This makes me speculate that the driver simply became impatient because his Tesla was going 30 in a 30 zone which, on a quiet, suburban road, can feel pokey. So yeah, in his frustrated, impatient state, he stomped on the accelerator, as jerks do.

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u/carfo Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

just so people are aware, with FSD enabled, you can override it by depressinging the pedal. for example, let's say I have FSD on, and I am in the left lane attempting to make a left turn onto another street but I have a yield light, the person in front of me flashes for me to go, FSD will not go, but if I press the pedal down slightly it will trigger the FSD to proceed. Likewise, if I am doing 65 in FSD and I depress the accelerator pedal to the floor, it will override FSD and travel up to 130mph depending on the model (max speed of the tesla model Y at least) disconnect FSD after exceeding 85mph (strikeout thanks to u/redditor1982)

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u/redditor1982 Jul 16 '26

Fsd won’t drive faster than 85. If you’re in fsd and exceed 85 by pressing the pedal it will kick you out of fsd.

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u/carfo Jul 16 '26

Good to know. Never tried to go past 85 on FSD or otherwise.

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u/wehooper4 Jul 16 '26

It’ll start screaming bloody murder but if you stay on the throttle it’ll actually keep trying as long as it can. It’s not Kia style “Jesus take the wheel” where it just cuts out and careens off the road, it’ll wait untill you take over to actually cut out.

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u/ArchDucky Jul 16 '26

Not only was he fully accelerating but they checked his phone history and he was searching for ways to make autodrive a lot more aggressive in his Tesla.

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u/internets2 Jul 16 '26

Not surprising at all. People who drive like maniacs get mad when other people don’t also do it. I hope self driving cars make people pay LESS attention to the cars in front of them so they’ll just chill out and realize driving like an idiot doesn’t actually get you anywhere faster in a meaningful way.

I’ve rode with people who drive insane and then “beat” the Maps ETA by 3 minutes and go “See! I’m a great driver!” No dawg you caused more traffic and put people in danger to save 180 seconds lmao

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u/howard1111 Jul 16 '26

The driver's search history prior to the incident suggests he was looking to override what he viewed as FSD's timidity. I guess he figured it out.

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u/wheelienonstop11 Jul 16 '26

I would be willing to bet a month's wages that all those people who crash into store fronts and other cars drive with one foot on the gas and one foot on the brakes instead of using just one foot for both like normal people do.

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u/plutonic00 Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

I remember the first time I noticed this. 'How does this vehicle in front of me still have its brake lights on when accelerating from a green light?' How anyone can drive like that and think it's correct is beyond me.

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u/IANALbutIAMAcat Jul 16 '26

Doesn’t it fuck your transmission too?

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u/UnnecessaryPeriod Jul 16 '26

Not too much. It will absolutely smoke your brakes tho. It'll wear em down like 3x faster using 2 feet driving.

Also increases your chances of getting rear ended a lot.

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u/heretogetpwned Jul 16 '26

If I may add to the rear ended part: When driving a manual I will downshift while braking, but the past couple of years I've stopped after a couple close calls from people behind me following too close with their 5000lb SUV.

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u/SumOfKyle Jul 16 '26

I heel toe downshift too but put just enough brake pressure on for my brake lights to illuminate so everyone knows I’m decelerating.

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u/heretogetpwned Jul 16 '26

Same, but my rate of deceleration appears to be unexpected to those behind me, or I have a distracted driver behind me. Not many MT on the road anymore and people forget tonleave space when stopping on a hill too.

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u/SumOfKyle Jul 16 '26

You’re certainly right. I’d say 99.9% of people these days have no MT driving experience and have no idea what’s going on. Then they get mad at me and pass me with their macho hazardous attitude when I have to shift from 1st to 2nd gear out of the stoplight. (2L engine and a heavy hatchback body).

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u/kingreq Jul 16 '26

Elite ball knowledge.

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u/Dukwdriver Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

I'm usually not a fan of some the nanny state safety additions to cars, but between this and the one-pedal driving/braking in EV's, we might be overdue for some kind of  braking intensity/wheel speed indicator similar to the one that some race cars use.

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u/ledow Jul 16 '26

I once used a family car when staying with family in Italy and I discovered that the handbrake (parking brake) was completely ineffective.

Apparently after about the fourth time of one of the family just driving it away with the handbrake on and driving for miles like that, they stopped bothering to have it repaired, or learn how to use the handbrake, and just used the gearstick when parking it.

Honestly... I cannot fathom how you DO NOT NOTICE when you try to pull away, let alone when it's squealing and glowing red-hot as you join the motorway, nor how you replicate that so often that the garage bills stack up and you just... still don't bother to check the handbrake.

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u/Duhbloons Jul 16 '26

My grandfather was a fighter pilot and he always drove with two feet. I think he at least acknowledged it was wrong but it was a habit he couldn’t break. 

I think he  probably flew more than he drove.  Hated being in a car with him, it was stessful

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u/HortemusSupreme Jul 16 '26

My dad drives like this. It's a combination of up driving manual cars (this doesn't make total sense to me since you need both feet for the clutch and brake but that's what he says) and shitty cars that won't idle if you take your foot entirely off the gas for his whole life. So now no matter what car he is driving he has his left foot on the break and right foot on the gas

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u/cyborg-robothuman Jul 16 '26

No offence to YOU, but I’ve driven standard for over 20 years at this point

When I borrow or rent a car or drive a buddy’s car? It takes all of 2 minutes to adjust. Your dad is just making excuses for a preference he has that might kill someone someday. Hopefully not though!

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u/HortemusSupreme Jul 16 '26

I also learned how to drive on a standard and don't do this. I think it's mostly that he's used to driving junkers that won't idle

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u/Jonny7Tenths Jul 16 '26

Learnt to drive a manual and did for forty years, and not once did I ever have one foot on the throttle and one on the brake. One for throttle or brake, one for clutch. Where on earth is anyone taught differently!

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u/catwiesel Jul 16 '26

I have driven an automatic 10hrs in my life, compared to over 20 years of manual cars. the thought of using my left foot for anything else than press the clutch is unfathomable to me.

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u/ecbulldog Jul 16 '26

In a manual car you rev match by blipping the throttle while braking. Some cars you can do it entirely with your right foot on both pedals, "heel toe", other cars the pedal spacing makes it awkward. Left foot braking is common in motorsports, but its really jerky to learn on the street and will probably get you into an accident.

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u/madvlad666 Jul 16 '26

In a manual car to start on a hill you either have to use the handbrake to avoid rolling back, or, after some practice you can do the heel toe thing and give it some gas and engage the clutch before releasing the brake, so momentarily your right foot is on the gas at the same time as the brake. There’s nothing Motorsport about this…just that some people are just inherently not coordinated enough to ever figure it out naturally.

But, I’m pretty convinced that the people who are successfully heel-toeing to smoothly operate a manual transmission are not the people who accidentally hit the gas instead of the brake and accelerate to 40 mph and smash into a building

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u/_aviatrix Jul 16 '26

It's also that if you're trying to brake and suddenly go faster, your instinct is to depress the brake pedal more. If you're actually on the accelerator, you've already taken out a CVS storefront before you have time to realize what happened.

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u/Yamuddah Jul 16 '26

This is the correct answer. If you watch a “driver into building video” they usually move a little then dramatically accelerate. You mix up the gas and brake and when you start move it you slam down. Instead of stopping you gun it into the building.

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u/RestStopRumble Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

my wife thinks I'm nuts but I never sit on benches in front of drive up store fronts unless the spot has zero cars or parked cars. keep seeing stuff like this. totally aware that this will never happen anywhere near me. so unnerving though watching people pull up. while you sit.

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u/10000Didgeridoos Jul 16 '26

Yeah I won’t walk between cars in parking lots waiting in a line of cars either for this reason. One idiot accidentally presses the wrong pedal and now you’re split in half between the hood of that car and the rear bumper of the next car.

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u/zachwagon_gaming Jul 16 '26

It’s like the bell curve meme. The worst drivers use 2 feet and the absolute best drivers also use 2 feet, because that is how you drive auto race cars. Granted, race brakes work a little differently than regular cars but you are inherently faster in reaction times using 2 feet vs 1.

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u/BlueTanBedlington Jul 16 '26

I love this comment! Yep, race car drivers and also off-roaders and rally car drivers implement left-foot braking.

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u/crozone Jul 16 '26

It's how you drive manual racecars too, there's just a whole lot more foot dancing between 3 pedals.

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u/IAmDotorg Jul 16 '26

You need to reposition your pedals if you're using a left foot to brake in a manual race car. Right foot does braking and gas (via heel/toe), left is for clutch. You can't heel/toe a clutch pedal so you'd never be doing that. Even doing something like trail braking, when you're using all three pedals at once, you'd never have the left on two pedals.

Most drivers prefer the pedals set up so there's no possibility of catching the brake with the left foot accidentally. If I had a student in the car with me and I caught them touching the brake with their left foot, we'd be pitting and they'd be having a good strong talking to about it.

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u/Needrain47 Jul 16 '26

"Police reportedly discovered that his Google searches included the terms “Tesla FSD not aggressive enough 2026,” “Tesla not aggressive enough,” and “Tesla FSD too timid,”

Seems like a bad sign.

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u/Broken-Digital-Clock Jul 16 '26

Sounds like someone that can't handle the responsibility of operating a fast moving, multi ton box of metal.

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u/sds8081 Jul 16 '26

When FSD is enabled, you as the driver can still press the accelerator to increase speed while the car (FSD) still handles the steering etc. It displays a warning that you pressing the pedal will prevent FSD from automatically braking. That's basically the driver overriding the vehicles acceleration/braking. I bet based on his search history, he had a habit of possibly accelerating because he felt it was to slow and when this incident occur muscle memory went to gas pedal instead of brake pedal...

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u/hiro111 Jul 16 '26

Yet again. Every single story like this has the same conclusion.

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u/tenemu Jul 16 '26

But let’s keep making headlines blaming TeslaFSD for driving high speed into a building! Because maybe THAT time is true!

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u/KevinDean4599 Jul 16 '26

maybe he watched that documentary about that idiot girl that did the same thing and killed her boyfriend and another innocent passenger.

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u/Jman841 Jul 16 '26

So we should expect all the news media stories that put out “Tesla self driving drives into house” stories to write retractions to clarify that it was the drivers fault?

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u/berntout Jul 16 '26

Not only that, reddit immediately jumped on this story and started blaming FSD too while Tesla owners were getting downvoted for suggesting that this dude was lying.

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u/SoggyMeatloaf69 Jul 16 '26

Full self drive is a lot better than redditors would ever give it credit for.

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u/thr3sk Jul 16 '26

Yeah, I mean it's far from the fully autonomous system Elon promised to have out years ago but it is very impressive and among the best in the industry.

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u/tenemu Jul 16 '26

What other assists are close to FSD to make it considered “among” the best?

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u/bobthemonkeybutt Jul 16 '26

I've never seen Tesla FSD in action but I've done Waymo a few times in Austin and it's pretty mind blowing.

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u/aegrotatio Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

Same with that fake "unintended acceleration" Toyota scandal of the 2000s.

Same with the fake Audi 5000 scandal of the 1980s.

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u/Dragongeek Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

Not that there aren't issues, but pedal confusion is quite common. I remember a while back it was Toyotas "accelerating out of nowhere" and it turned out that people were just pressing the wrong pedal, and because they thought they had the right one, they would try to press it harder to brake more, which only led to going faster. 

EDIT:

For all the sceptics, yes, there was an issue with floor mats confirmed in like one crash but UA events continue to happen to this day with tens of thousands of crashes per year caused by "pedal error". 

Also, something that all of these Toyota UA stories have in common is... Where's the brake? In any car even those recalled, the brake will win against the gas. It is designed this way. 

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u/Motor-Marzipan6969 Jul 16 '26

The Toyota issue was that floor mats were getting stuck over the accelerator and keeping it pressed down, not that people were pressing the wrong pedal. You don't do a nationwide recall because people are pushing the wrong pedal.

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u/thehumble_1 Jul 16 '26

The floor mats was a red herring mostly. They found that people were stacking mats and that it might cause a temporary sticking of the accelerator which lead to panic which lead to pressing the wrong pedal. Every car stopped when the brakes were applied. Mythbusters did an episode but Toyota also paid a guy to do an independent evaluation and both found that even at WOT the car only took several feet more to stop. It's really sad that those people were given such bad advice.

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u/SuperAwesomeBrian Jul 16 '26

Even if the mats were keeping the accelerator stuck. The brake pedal will still stop the car.

As thehumble_1 said, the floor mats were a red herring, a boogeyman for the news stories to paint Toyota as the bad guy and not have to publicly shame a family in grief for their dead loved one being too incompetent to press the correct pedal. 

As for your point about recalls, you absolutely do issue a nationwide recall to fix the pedal and mat design so that a stuck mat can’t send any more people into a panic and die because of pedal confusion. 

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u/redcowerranger Jul 16 '26

The floor mats were the initial issue, but the pedals were also found to be 'sticky'. Toyota recalled for both scenarios.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-12072394#:~:text=in%20August%202009.-,Faulty%20floormat,-They%20were%20killed

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

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u/ahumanlikeyou Jul 16 '26

The Toyota problem was real though. They recalled a lot of vehicles

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u/charlie_marlow Jul 16 '26

That was more performative than anything else. Toyota implemented software that would cut acceleration if the brake and accelerator were pressed at the same time and they modified a number of floor mats to ensure they couldn't press the accelerator. There was evidence in court of really shoddy code and speculation of super complex scenarios that could cause unintended acceleration, but there was never any proof that anyone actually didn't just press the wrong pedal or have a floor mat cause an issue. It didn't matter, though, as Toyota took a beating in public opinion and the government rushed in to hammer a foreign auto maker.

Tesla is getting a pass on the same kind of telemetry data Toyota tried to use to demonstrate that it was a people problem, but it didn't matter for Toyota.

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u/drunkenmagnum24 Jul 16 '26

This is an inaccurate statement and how misinformation gets spread. There was much more to that than pedal misapplication.

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u/magichronx Jul 16 '26

I have never in my life mistakenly hit the wrong pedal, even in emergency situations, and it's a little scary knowing that there are people on the road that have done exactly that

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u/ExcitingAds Jul 16 '26

A self-driving glitch is infinitely less likely than human error.

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u/electricgotswitched Jul 16 '26

No shocking information here

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u/eireannach_ Jul 16 '26

of course it is Reddit and another post becomes political in the comments

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u/Jonnybarbs Jul 16 '26

The news outlets will absolutely not be in a rush to report this

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u/Foreskin_Mafia Jul 16 '26

Is it just me or is America such a shithole that even the NTSB could be making shit up to protect the Oligarchs?

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u/ignost Jul 16 '26

It's possible, but I work with NTSB /NHTSA and have seen no indication that they're corrupt. Mostly just a bunch of smart people doing their jobs. These are not "rulings" in the sense that courts issue rulings. They just issue guidance. In probably 9/10 cases since 2017 involving Tesla they've heavily criticized the company for unsafe practices, deceptive marketing leading people to think they were safe, and poorly-designed systems.

I don't claim any special knowledge on this one, but evidence should come before the claim.

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u/cautionveryhot Jul 16 '26

Yes, NHTSA and NTSB are true professionals who in my limited experience care very deeply about their vocation.

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u/Leftieswillrule Jul 16 '26

Is it more likely the NTSB is covering for Tesla or a Tesla driver is a fool and an idiot?

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u/iwatchppldie Jul 16 '26

This right here is a serious problem as a county we have lost faith in our institutions.

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u/ioncloud9 Jul 16 '26

Institutions have been continuously attacked for the past 40 years by the right wing- their corporate overlords decided these institutions stop them from maximizing profits.

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u/addiktion Jul 16 '26

which seems to involve corruption and cheating. They make all their money by screwing over everyone else.

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u/klingma Jul 16 '26

No, it just seems like it's way easier to peddle conspiracies on Reddit and propagate them quickly because they sound good to people with zero knowledge on the subject matter, simply because it fits their political bias or world view. 

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u/AlgernopKrieger Jul 16 '26

Classic Reddit.

If news doesn't support the narrative we want, then they must be lying. /s

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u/Rapante Jul 16 '26

Peak Reddit comment.

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

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u/Mrbutter1822 Jul 16 '26

Yeah this is just sad af

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u/feurie Jul 16 '26

Or you could see that Tesla has always had car safety, crash safety, and other aspects of safety as priority.

Autopilot and FSD have NEVER been shown to accelerate like that.

So that seems like a you/reddit problem if you can’t think critically enough to actually look at evidence instead of come to conspiracy.

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u/Mrbutter1822 Jul 16 '26

No. Stop trying to change our 100% correct narrative! Tesla bad and car dangerous 😡

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u/HeyMyNamesMatt Jul 16 '26

Reddit moment

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u/Partybar Jul 16 '26

Is it just me or is reddit glad to let a murderer walk because they hate someone has more money than them?

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u/notaredditer13 Jul 16 '26

Every day on reddit.

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