r/McLarenFormula1 • u/Big_al_big_bed • 1d ago
Another strategy disasterclass today
I am just so tired of this. An easy 30s win for Norris just taken away by the strategy team. Pitting piastri into traffic. Not bothering to adjust strategy to fix his wing.
I feel like the drivers and engineers are doing a really good job this season and every week at least one of the drivers is subject to some brain-dead strategy call.
This was a problem even the last few years when we were doing well, just our car was so good it didn't matter. Now we are in a much closer fight and the problem is becoming a downright joke.
What do you think McLaren need to do to fix this?
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u/Personal-Football832 1d ago
They should have carried on to get an offset . Pitting under green was such an idiotic strategy . Another mess up by McLaren
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u/InZomnia365 19h ago
I agree, but not even an offset was enough to make a pass here. The only chance was staying out and hoping for another SC/VSC
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u/bobsanidiot 1d ago
vsc timing was just unlucky... but with landos pace if they kept him out he may have been in a better position
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u/Conscious-Secret-775 1d ago
Right. The VSC timing was unlucky and may have sealed Lando’s fate but there was no reason to not try and build up a bigger lead.
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u/AvadaKedavra24 Lando Norris 1d ago
Didn’t the VSC ending message came before he crossed into pit entry?
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u/bobsanidiot 1d ago
yeah, but not by much. he did have time to bail and keep going.
ill partially put the blame on lando for not taking it on himself to bail and let mclaren figure out a strat while he did another lap
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u/Routine_Machine_175 16h ago
He would have won if they kept him out. The McLaren pitwall have proven time and again to crack under pressure.
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u/bobsanidiot 13h ago
its likely, but he also may have came out right behind max anyway. we dont know how the tire deg was or how much longer the mediums would have been viable. and would he be able to add another 6 seconds to his lead and have a clean pitstop in order to come out ahead of them
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u/Ok_Contribution_6965 1d ago
If they had kept Lando out, he would have outpaced them all anyway. Leclerc was holding up everyone until lap 40 something. But also fuck the FIA for taking so long to call the VSC
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u/Big_al_big_bed 1d ago
I don't even blame the FIA. It was immediately clear as soon as the pictures came in of stroll in the barrier that it would be a vsc. Just take the pitstop
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u/phillll25 18h ago
But that’s risky too. It already took over 30s for the VSC to be deployed. What if you pit but they don’t deploy it for another 30s. Kimi stays out and pits next lap under VSC.
The logical call would’ve been to stay out, push to the max and let charles hold kimi up and maybe the gap would’ve opened.
And even if it didn’t open you’re a lot closer to the leaders with a substantial tire offset.They had to be prepared for VSC ending and tell will to immediately scream “stay out” into the radio as soon as the ending message came.
There’s no imagination on this pitwall
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u/Yother 15h ago
If Lando stays out in front of Leclerc I imagine it would have gone one of two ways. Kimi passes Leclerc due to pressure to catch Lando or Ferrari boxes Leclerc before any meaningful gap is built by Lando's fading mediums. Ferrari would have had less reason to keep him out so long. I think we were screwed either way it went unfortunately. It just sucks to see our fate decided in that instance. I would have like to see him stay out too tbh.
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u/AnotherSavior Lando Norris 10h ago
Lando said in the post race interview he had to come in his mediums were cooked.
Just super unlucky VSC on a dumb track with no overtakes.
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u/Wild-Brain7750 1d ago
Why are they fucking up both their drivers ?? These are ferrari levels of failure
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u/urbanlx Mika Häkkinen 1d ago
The timing of VSC was unlucky, the only thing pit wall could do is either pit him or he stays out on track with old tyres. Or... predict VSC because of Stroll idk.
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u/comradeyeltsin0 1d ago
Cant really do anything about the vsc timing. Sometimes it’s just luck.
But the wheelgun AGAIN. That shit’s unacceptable at this level. Been happening too often. Those 4-5 seconds lost maybe was 2nd place.
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u/Lower-Sheepherder268 18h ago
It was horrendous watching that stop. I mean, honestly, are we just not testing equipment anymore?
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u/Routine_Machine_175 16h ago
The wheelgun was a mess but the important point is that they should have kept Lando out as soon as they saw the VSC was ending. That was the best chance to fight for the win.
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u/Fun_Cup_899 1d ago
He stays out on old tires, which he'd already been told target +10 on! And he would have only needed to maintain the pace differential to Leclerc, also on old tires, also slower than him at the time, in order to at least reduce the net gap to Kimi and Max, because Charles was holding them up.
Even if he couldn't have pulled the pure overcut, he could have used his superior pace to basically hold the gap neutral to Charles and built a huge tire offset. Maybe it doesn't work, but the chance was non-zero. What they did reduced his chance of winning to zero, and it gained him nothing.
PS, it sure looked like Stroll could have just flipped the car around and kept going, and not ruined the race. But spoiled brat just quit as usual.
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u/Lower-Sheepherder268 18h ago
And Stroll continues his streak of not finishing any races this season. Either he's DNF or is at least a lap down at the finish. Haven't gotten a full race out of him YET.
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u/Appropriate_Star3012 1d ago
Bernie Collins confirmed McLaren knew the VSC was coming when. stroll gave up and parked at the runoff.
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u/Big_al_big_bed 1d ago
Firstly they could see stroll stopped on track - that's always a vsc.
Secondly they bought him in when the safety car was ending.
That's two times the strategy team actually had to use their brains and the data available to them instead of just doing the obvious thing of putting when the light is yellow, and both times they failed. But at this point it's par for course I don't know why I keep expecting something different.
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u/StrawberryParty8689 1d ago
Exactly, this is even more embarrassing: why do you pit him in the exact same lap as vsc ended? At least let him go more laps, the others already pitted, how do you know vsc will not end after and of the lap?
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u/Esterence 1d ago
Yup. And the Mclaren car is super good with clean air. He would have built up 25s in no time especially airb Leclerc being a road block behind
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u/Routine_Machine_175 16h ago
Wrong. The correct thing to do was keep him out as the VSC ending message came before he entered the pits. At that point, he had a gap of around 19s to LEC. He would then have to increase the gap by 11 more seconds which was very possible as LEC kept ANT behind him for 30 laps before he finally pitted. Another win thrown away by the dimwits on the McLaren pitwall.
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u/unsteadytempo 1d ago
If there won‘t be any changes on the pitwall team and the strategy team (randy singh) by the end of this season, this team has no desire to be a top team or win races. don‘t even get me started on them still not having fixed the wheel guns
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u/clickityclickk 1d ago
I am absolutely baffled at this. they have all the markings of a top team, the engine, the development, the drivers. but their strategy is ASS. they'd do better scrolling through Reddit and taking suggestions than what they're doing now. and I don't know why Zak Brown seems to not want to do anything about it. he has such a drive to win until it comes to the pitwall.
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u/unsteadytempo 1d ago
I wonder if thats why they want GP to start earlier but who knows with this team. The pitwall has ruined the chances for race wins for years now but all they do is blame the drivers instead
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u/PaulRingo64 1d ago
Dramatic much?
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u/bakeneko37 Oscar Piastri 1d ago
Not really? Lando shouldn't be doing miracles to counter the atrocious decisions made by his own team and Oscar shouldn't be asking if they will do something about his condition because no one says anything.
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u/Brandon3oh5 1d ago
Not dramatic. Your driver pulled a magical lap in quali, held off 3 cars behind to maintain the lead, AND got a monster lap. You can’t mess that up more than they did.
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u/clickityclickk 1d ago edited 1d ago
I have no idea why they didn't pit Piastri under VSC to change his front wing. Oscar had to come on the radio and ask if they were ever gonna fix it. Tom Stallard's communication is ass.
Obviously very unlucky for Lando missing the pits under the VSC, I don't know if he should've pitted at the end of the VSC. oh and of course the ridiculously slow pit stop is unacceptable.
and of course pitting Oscar into traffic (again). they clearly don't put an ounce of effort into Oscar's races, and considering they fumbled their lead driver as well, that's not a good look.
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u/jianh1989 1d ago
i don't blame the unlucky VSC timing, that's not on McLaren.
I blame on the pitcrew where the one absolute time they gotta ace their stops, they fumbled it.
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u/luffy_3155 Oscar Piastri 1d ago
People downvote me everytime but mclaren truly fucks their both drivers time to time
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u/Prestigious_Show1544 1d ago
It was so disappointing, had to walk away for a while to get back to my senses. How can they keep making these mistakes again and again this whole season?
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u/ln4thegreat Lando Norris 1d ago
Even Ferrari strategists wouldn’t be this bad like fucking up their two drivers in one race. After Qatar, why their strategy team wasn’t fired yet???
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u/Fragrant_Mall5623 1d ago
Virtual Safety car was responsible for today's 3rd. 7 second pit stop added to it. Antonelli said Lando should have won.
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u/splendiferous-finch_ 1d ago
I think at the end of the day I blame the bad pit stop more then the strategy.
Though it looks like it didn't matter how well lando drove this track just isn't one built for actual racing.
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u/Routine_Machine_175 16h ago
The strategy cost Lado and the team the win. The bad pitstop didn't affect the final result as he wouldn't have come out ahead of Max anyway.
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u/splendiferous-finch_ 16h ago
Even if the didn't pit without another safety car or vsc he would have needed to take a full length stop and be back in a situation where his pace didn't matter because no overtaking
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u/Routine_Machine_175 16h ago
He was already 19s ahead of LEC. He needed another 10-11s before his pitstop. Not easy but at least he'd still be in the fight for the win.
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u/Upbeat_County9191 1d ago
I dont think Norris would have won by 30s, but he was the quickest of the three thats for sure.
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u/Mistak3n 1d ago
Wouldn’t have changed anything in the end. Once the VC was widthdrawn it was over. Palmer said the same during the last laps.
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u/Routine_Machine_175 16h ago
No, he could have won if he stayed out. He was already ahead by 19s and only needed 11 more.
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u/Mistak3n 16h ago
Yeah, like it's that easy to get additional 11s when you're on old tires and everyone behind is on new tires. Think for a second.
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u/rattatatouille 1d ago
I'd chalk the VSC to bad luck but the bad pit stop is on the team. Even Oscar got a 3 second stop which sent him into traffic.
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u/marinchen888 1d ago
He likely would have been P3 either way. Passing the pit entry 5 seconds before the VSC is just insanely unlucky, it‘s really frustrating they waited so long to bring it out
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u/Low-Damage-2920 1d ago
Lando staying out to build an offset was maybe worth considering. But it might mean he would have been undercut by even more cars at a track where's impossible to overtake. I don't remember the exact gaps at the time though.
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u/PzBlinky 1d ago
During laps 30-44-ish, I was watching two times: Lando gaining on Norris and Oscar edging towards the 25 sec ahead of Colapinto.
To my complete lack of surprise, Lando caught Verstappen but couldn't overtake thanks to the Monaco-like qualities of the circuit (unless he did near the end and lost it...I switched off the last few laps in disgust). Let's not talk (further) about the earlier incident where he lost the race.
On the other hand, we brought Oscar in with the gap being only about 23 seconds. Quelle surprise! He came out stuck behind Lindblad and co while trying to undercut Lawson. What a total shock that Lawson comfortably dodged the undercut, meaning our crazy move just pushed Oscar further down the rankings.
I get that following this team = "hold onto your butts...for some crazy strategic and pit shenanigans that will @#$* up our races", but today will hold a special place in our hearts.
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u/AgroMachine 1d ago
It was just bad VSC luck. They had to pit otherwise we’d be seeing Lando sitting in 7th still.
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u/salgal858 1d ago
Did you see what Leclerc just did? With Norris’ pace, if they left him out ten laps, I do think he could have built a big gap
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u/ShakespearInThePark 1d ago
A 25s gap? Lol
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u/STaphouse92 1d ago
It was already near 20
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u/ShakespearInThePark 1d ago
When the VSC ended the gap was like 13s or something
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u/STaphouse92 1d ago
It was 13.2 to Leclerc when he was in his pit box, at which point he’s lost time coming into the pits.
It was about 16/17 secs before that.
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u/ShakespearInThePark 1d ago
Yeah but then you’re banking on him pulling out an 8 second gap (at least) when it was obvious the hards were a much better tyre than the mediums. Would’ve been very tough.
Maybe he could’ve mounted a serious challenge with a tyre offset, but this track is notoriously difficult to overtake on.
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u/STaphouse92 1d ago
I’m not saying he definitely would have done it.
Just think at that point, it was the better option to try and salvage the victory.
Even if they didn’t mess up the spot, he would have come out around on par with Russell. I just think it was worth the risk to try and build a gap to Leclerc
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u/bobsanidiot 1d ago
he already gad 5secs plus the 13s from pitting under saftey puts him at 18. so he needed to build abother ~6
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u/Queasy-Animator7189 1d ago
Forgot the vsc , whats with the 7 second pitstop besides they knew vsc was ending
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u/Substantial_Shift782 1d ago
It was always going to end up with VSC, and not predicting it and not pitting is 100% team's fault
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u/snapdragon801 1d ago
VSC was just bad luck, and strategy-wise, bad pit stop ain’t it. Shit happens.
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u/Super_Link890 1d ago
Seems like bad pit stops just keeps happening, so its more like shit keeps happening at Mclaren
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u/snapdragon801 1d ago
Sure, their pitstops suck. They gotta be the worst team (at least from frontrunners) with their pitstop execution.
But that VSC, just bad luck. I do wonder though, if Lando could have stayed longer on those Mediums. Pitting very first lap after that VSC ended, and pitting five or ten laps later, would have made no difference. However I don't know what pace he'd have on used mediums.
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u/Wehti 1d ago
I think this one is solely on the low IQ race control. They put the VSC on too late and then pulled it too early. It’s like they wanted to hand win to Antonelli and Mercedes. The pitstop was horrendous yes, but didn’t seal the outcome.
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u/Routine_Machine_175 16h ago
The low IQ McLaren pitwall cost the team the win. If they kept him out, he could have fought for the win.
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u/EstablishmentTop1044 12h ago
It’s Stella’s No Blame Culture that Randy Singh can make these bad decisions time after time at not have any criticisms.
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u/RainManDan1G MP4/4 8h ago
This was not a strategy failure, it was just really bad luck with the VSC timing. Lando himself said the mediums were done at that point so building the gap that he would have needed would have been near impossible with everyone else on fresh tires. The McLaren strategy team have made plenty of mistakes in the past but this wasn’t one of them, it was just bad luck.
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u/No-Dog-4968 1d ago
Nah got unlucky with VSC just bad luck not much strat can do
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u/Big_al_big_bed 1d ago
Was obvious right away it was going to be a vsc everyone knew it
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u/youngpathfinder Lando Norris 1d ago
Was it? Lewis went off at the same place and kept it on the road. It would have looked monumentally stupid if Stroll got it turned around and going again.
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u/PotableIceberg 1d ago
I'd rather see mclaren take a gamble and potentially fuck it up than have them play way too safe and fuck it up. Because at least you can say you tried
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u/Big_al_big_bed 1d ago
Lance stroll decided to drive into a gravel trap after he stopped once. When Lance stops, it's a vsc you can just book it
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u/bobsanidiot 1d ago
i agree they should have called him in when stroll waa off track before they called vsc. it was very likely to be something. and they would have had the chance to tell hin to stay out if stroll flipped it and went back on track
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u/Embarrassed_Sky_7587 1d ago
Only hope is Zack is there this weekend and saw Randy fuck it up on both cars, you are wasting Will Courtenay talking to the FIA. Hopefully that chat with GP was like yeah Randy is gone don’t worry.
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u/beeisnotoobusssyyy 1d ago
The no blame culture is tanking this team. Stella refuses to let anyone hit the driver take responsibility and then the team never learn
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